Ideas for nerfing wood elfs - round 4: Proposal

plasmoid · Post by **plasmoid** » Sat May 09, 2009 6:26 pm

ARH BUGGER - POLLs SUPPOSED TO SAY LOSE BLOCK/DODGE. NOT "LIKE".

Round 3: The poll!

The list was
Remove the treeman
Throwers dropped to ST2 - possibly with a cruddy skill to keep the price up.
Linemen dropped to ST2 (now that would change the team!)
Only 0-2 catchers
Rerolls 60K

Wardancers to 130K
Wardancers get MA7
Wardancers lose block
Wardancers lose block, gain side step.
Wardancers lose block, gain jump up.
Wardancers lose block, gain grab.
Wardancers lose block, get MA7, but gain fend
Wardancers lose block, get MA7, but gain side step
Wardancers lose dodge
Wardancers lose dodge, get MA7
Wardancers lose dodge, get MA7, but gain fend

I've not included any suggestions that reversed the LRB6 tweak to catchers, nor any suggestions considered by their original poster to be downright wacky (I'm looking at you Mattgslater)

plasmoid · Post by **plasmoid** » Sat May 09, 2009 6:29 pm

Right. Arguably the most hated team in the game.
But what to do.

I might as well mention "Remove the Treeman" before someone else does.
But I have to say, hoenestly, that I don't think it's a good idea myself.
It isn't used by most starting WE teams (when they're at their best).
And perhaps even more than undead, these guys start out extremely strong, but crumble hard at high TV.
Nixing the tree will just hurt them when they don't need to be hurt.

Cheers
Martin

SillySod · Post by **SillySod** » Sat May 09, 2009 6:44 pm

Make the catchers Ma9 but lose sprint. Hurt the wardancers by taking away dodge, block, Ma8.... there are lots of ways to nerf wardancers and they will still be great pieces.

Alternative package:
- make woodie linemen 60k
- make catchers LRB5 catchers (possibly with a 10k price hike)
- nuke wardancers
- possibly raise their RRs to 60k

Similarly I'd make pro elf linemen 50k.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sat May 09, 2009 6:49 pm

simple, remove block from wardancers

it is them that is the problem

leaving them with dodge and leap still fits the fluff as being prancing show offs

stops them being overpowered straight off and shifts their skill progression back one (though they might take wrestle instead of block as well, meaning wood elf teams might have a slightly different build)

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Sat May 09, 2009 7:45 pm

All elves Ag3... done....

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Sat May 09, 2009 9:20 pm

0-16 Line-Elf
0-2 Catcher
0-2 Thrower
0-2 Wardancer 8/3/4/7 Block, Leap 110k
0-1 Treeman
TRR: 50k

Now only up to 2 guys start with Dodge. Since Dodge builds on itself, this is a big deal. Heck, you could keep 0-4 Catchers, or if you go down to 2 you can go back to MA9. But take WDs down a peg, and taking off Dodge is both fluffier and more BB-consistent than taking off Block (after all, he is a Blitzer-type positional). Dropping Dodge also reduces the cheese factor more without a disproportionate reduction in utility, which is a benefit in this context.

So at the same price...
Pro Blitzer: +AV, Block, Side Step
Wardancer: +MA, Block, Leap
Witch Elf: Dodge, Frenzy, Jump Up on a team with 2 more positionals (sort of)

atropabelladonna · Post by **atropabelladonna** » Sat May 09, 2009 9:36 pm

Grumbledook wrote:simple, remove block from wardancers

it is them that is the problem

leaving them with dodge and leap still fits the fluff as being prancing show offs

stops them being overpowered straight off and shifts their skill progression back one (though they might take wrestle instead of block as well, meaning wood elf teams might have a slightly different build)

I agree with this. All that is needed.

Mysterious Stranger · Sat May 09, 2009 10:57 pm

Digger Goreman wrote:All elves Ag3... done....

God, yes.

Andromidius · Post by **Andromidius** » Sun May 10, 2009 9:08 am

Make Wardancers MA7 with Fend instead of Block.

~Andromidius

SillySod · Post by **SillySod** » Sun May 10, 2009 9:16 am

Andromidius wrote:Make Wardancers MA7 with Fend instead of Block.

~Andromidius

How about Ma7 with fend instead of dodge?

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Sun May 10, 2009 9:53 am

it is the block and leap combo that is the pain

leaving them with dodge and leap fits their background best, ergo remove block

Andromidius · Post by **Andromidius** » Sun May 10, 2009 12:33 pm

SillySod wrote:
Andromidius wrote:Make Wardancers MA7 with Fend instead of Block.

~Andromidius
How about Ma7 with fend instead of dodge?

Maybe, though without Block they won't be able to get CAS SPP's so quickly. Which appeals to me.

Gives them a much more 'dancy' image as well.

~Andromidius

Mysterious Stranger · Post by **Mysterious Stranger** » Sun May 10, 2009 4:09 pm

SillySod wrote:
Andromidius wrote:Make Wardancers MA7 with Fend instead of Block.
How about Ma7 with fend instead of dodge?

How about MA7 with Side Step instead of Block? More "dancing"...

Joemanji · Post by **Joemanji** » Sun May 10, 2009 4:24 pm

Remove Block from wardancers. Give them nothing in return, but leave them with MA8. Maybe 110K.

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Sun May 10, 2009 5:34 pm

I definitely think Wardancers, per WH fluff, should start with Leap and Block. Yes, it makes them powerful. But that's OK. 110k AV7 players should be powerful.

Removing Dodge:
a) weakens Catchers without actually modifying them, by taking pressure off of Tacklers;
b) removes a skill the WD will want to buy straight back right away. An AV7 player worth 130k better be a Blodger. By comparison, WDs who start with Dodge will get Wrestle instead of Block. Ya wanna see annoying?
c) keeps the team in players with Block. Wood Elves shouldn't look like a specialty team.

If removing Dodge alone isn't enough, nerf the Catchers. I already suggested 0-2, but how about this?

0-4 Catcher 9/2/4/7 Catch, Dodge, GA/PS, 100k
0-2 Wardancer 8/3/4/7 Block, Leap GA/PS, 110k

Talk Fantasy Football

Ideas for nerfing wood elfs - round 4: Proposal

Which nerf best suits wood elfs?

Ideas for nerfing wood elfs - round 4: Proposal