Yet another try for a new Wild Animal

[Milo]

The only issue i have with Wild animal is the enforced first move before doing anything else. I would prefer when activated then the WA must make a block if in an opponents TZ, whether it be first move or last.

If you didn't have to move him first, it would be too easy to negate the bad aspects by moving other players to cancel assists, block people away from the Wild Animal, etc.

Milo

[DoubleSkulls]

What I really don't like about WA is the fact that with a couple of skills it doesn't make too much difference. Its much worse than Really Stupid or Bonehead at the start but once you've got block & pro, better or at least equal.

WA ought to be pretty bad all the time.

[Thadrin]

Hence the "on a 1 he goes bonkers and starts moving on a scatter" rule! Huzzah.

[Sixpack595]

The only issue i have with Wild animal is the enforced first move before doing anything else. I would prefer when activated then the WA must make a block if in an opponents TZ, whether it be first move or last.

If you didn't have to move him first, it would be too easy to negate the bad aspects by moving other players to cancel assists, block people away from the Wild Animal, etc.

Milo

OK, so now the WA's player needs to commit 2 or 3 guys to saving him...

If my Rat Ogre is tying up three or four of your players, I'm not going to complain about that.

Now 3 or 4 of his (I hope) linemen tied up your WA and a couple of your guys now need to negate assists, move people away etc... you now have 6 guys standing around playing a game mechanic instead of BB. If that doesn't make it a stupid rule, what about the fact that no one with a choice of big guys takes a WA, and that they often ride the bench, unlike any of the other nega-traits? Game on the line? Bench your most expensive player...

[Milo]

If my Rat Ogre is tying up three or four of your players, I'm not going to complain about that.

Now 3 or 4 of his (I hope) linemen tied up your WA and a couple of your guys now need to negate assists, move people away etc... you now have 6 guys standing around playing a game mechanic instead of BB. If that doesn't make it a stupid rule, what about the fact that no one with a choice of big guys takes a WA, and that they often ride the bench, unlike any of the other nega-traits? Game on the line? Bench your most expensive player...

Um, dude, I hate to tell you this, but EVERY player on a BB Pitch is playing a game mechanic of some sort. Does that make it all stupid rules?

If a coach leaves a player in position to attempt an interception, isn't that playing a game mechanic? Isn't moving one of your players up for an assist playing a game mechanic?

This argument just doesn't seem to make much sense to me.

And yes, if the game is on the line and nothing short of a perfect game will win it for me, I'm certainly going to bench my most unreliable player. The same could very well be true if I had a player with Frenzy, who could potentially put themselves in a disadvantaged position with the must-block/must-follow-up rules. The fact that he's also the most expensive has nothing to do with it.

[McDeth]

The only issue i have with Wild animal is the enforced first move before doing anything else. I would prefer when activated then the WA must make a block if in an opponents TZ, whether it be first move or last.

If you didn't have to move him first, it would be too easy to negate the bad aspects by moving other players to cancel assists, block people away from the Wild Animal, etc.

Milo

Your right of course and i know your right, i just dont like the rule as it stands currently, but unfortunately i'm stuck like every one else at coming up with a universally acceptable variant

[Milo]

If you didn't have to move him first, it would be too easy to negate the bad aspects by moving other players to cancel assists, block people away from the Wild Animal, etc.

Milo

Your right of course and i know your right, i just dont like the rule as it stands currently, but unfortunately i'm stuck like every one else at coming up with a universally acceptable variant

When it comes to the Rat Ogre, you're getting a fast, agile, strong big guy with some useful skills/traits. I think a player with his qualities needs to have a high-risk kind of negative trait to balance the high reward you get from having such a univerally good player on the pitch. Wild Animal is that trait. When he's at his best, he's one of the top players on the pitch, but he's risky and can easily cost you if you don't manage him carefully.

Ogres don't have quite as good a statline, but they also aren't as prone to cause turnovers and you have more leeway about how to use him.

Milo

[Skummy]

The quadruple whammy of no assists, forced block, forced to go first, and no rerolls is a real killer. Maybe if WA's were able to get assists? Then they could mix it up with a little more security, but would have to be guarded well.

[Balrog]

So far, I consider the current Wild Animal to be very well balanced.

Milo

It may be balanced, but it's not very "wild", I much preferred the old 3rd ed. wild animal rule (although it also had problems).

-Balrog

[Al the Rat]

My main problem with the rule is that it encourages people to play the WA and not play the ball. Playing to force your opponent to roll dice is fair enough, but playing to force odds against blocks is just a bit cheesy, particularly since with frenzy chances are that the WA has to roll 4 block dice without rolling a skull on any of them. Pretty good odds I reckon.

As it stands though WAs are playable, you just have to be very, very careful with them.

[MistWraith]

I do not know about Rat Ogers, but my Minotaur has caused more turnovers than openings. He is nowhere near as good as a oger, dispite having similar stats and cost.

Maybe the problem is not with WA, but with Boneheaded. Maybe Boneheaded needs to be more negative.

[redlizard]

My main problem with the rule is that it encourages people to play the WA and not play the ball.

Amen.

[Sixpack595]

Its something arbitrary, put in for balance. Interceptions add to the game, and make sense. WA was a couple guys trying to find a way to keep big guys from being overpowered. Sorry you missed the point, I wasn't clear enough. Its a stupid rule if it was added solely for balance, but results in an imbalance, and a less enjoyable game. How many Minotaurs do you have in your league? Rat Ogres? We have almost none, that tells me WA is a stupid rule.

Um, dude, I hate to tell you this, but EVERY player on a BB Pitch is playing a game mechanic of some sort. Does that make it all stupid rules?

[martynq]

The problem I have with WA is that if you don't play the WA then the negative trait has no effect. The problem the WA has is that he has to block if he is next to someone. If he isn't next to someone then you can do whatever you like with him. So an opponent has a simple choice:

(1) Play the WA and hope that he rolls skulls when blocking, or

(2) Allow the WA freedom to move and his opponent to have this strong agile monster to rampage across the pitch.

The current rule doesn't allow for any inbetween.

Martyn

[Redfang]

Maybe the problem is not with WA, but with Boneheaded. Maybe Boneheaded needs to be more negative.

Yes, finally somebody else sees the same!

That would also take care of the obligatory ogre found on each team that can have one!

R