GW bringing back Specialist Games?!?

[Milo]

I'd pick up a 'new' version of WHQ in a heartbeat. As long as I think the rules are still easy enough to allow me to play it with the kids...
Yeah, I'd love that.

Me too. The success of games like Super Dungeon Explore might help convince GW's new specialist guy (whomever that should be) that Warhammer Quest is due for a re-release. I frankly think that games like BB and WHQ could be released more or less as-is and generate income for the new division right away, especially if BB is advertised successfully to the new Blood Bowl players generated by the computer game.

The key is, I think, that the games need to be profitable in their own right, as some of the specialist games do not generate a lot of add-on sales (such as Space Hulk.) GW is adamant that the new Specialist Games division be profitable, not just about catering to a few remaining hobbyists.

[Regash]

We've been playing WHQ a couple of weeks ago.
And yes, we've been playing it with kids.
I really didn't remember how absolutely random WHQ was!
Really, there have been so much randomness in it, even the kids didn't like it.

What I'd really be insterested to play again is Mordheim.
The computer game is still rather high priced for my taste, though. (Anyone knows if this is PvP only or do they have an AI in it?)
And for the real game I'll be missing players, I'm afraid.

Oh man, where have the good times gone to, when homework and little pocket money were your only problems!

[Milo]

I know that I'm summarizing it a lot but at the end of it, the article talks about 3 kind of "meta-playstyles" and how every player can be fit in some percentage in one or more of them. Basically they are:

Competitive players: Those who play to win and only find satisfaction in winning.

Social players: Those who play to win but can find satisfaction in a good game as a kind of a social interaction.

Narrative players: Those who don't care about winning or losing they care about the storytelling (background history, events that happens during the game, etc.)

Before I continue, I want to remark that I find the three playstyles valid and good. I'm no one to judge how someone can find fun in a game.

I really, really like this post. If I were the specialist games manager, I would try to take steps to ensure that all of these players are kept under the umbrella. I think that since 2nd Edition the trend has been away from Narrative Players and towards Competitive Players, and while I do think that has been good for the game in general, I can understand the appeal of the Narrative aspects and don't want to remove them from the game entirely.

Recently, I've been playing in a tabletop league that not only features such items as permanent Wizards, Star Players, and the special play cards, but has even reduced the price of them to make them more prevalent. Do these changes make the game more "random"? Sure, but they also contribute to a bunch of fun and interesting stories which I hope our league will be talking about for years to come. One of the strengths of Blood Bowl is that it generates these moments while still being an intensely strategic game.

But I can definitely understand the downside of them. I once saw a league championship game between two evenly matched Wood Elf teams completely wrecked by a 0th-turn Pitch Invasion which (under 3rd Ed rules) resulted in three star players from one team being removed from the game by casualties. While memorable, it wasn't very much fun for the victim and even the beneficiary felt quite bad through the rest of the game. I think there could be room, both in the fluff and the rules, for certain games to use less randomness than the average league match.

[MattDakka]

(Anyone knows if this is PvP only or do they have an AI in it?)

The game can be played PvP and vs AI (I don't have the game but a friend of mine does).
So far only 4 warbands are available, though.

[Darkson]

(All of this is of course IF they re-release any games.)

As we still regularly play Necromunda and Mordheim I hope they don't change them much, if at all.

WHQ is a favourite as well, so would be happy to see that come back.

Never got into Epic or BFG, I'd rather see a return to the original Titan/Space Marines days (i.e. Epic mk1). Warmaster always held the same amount of interest for me as WFB i.e. none, so don't really care if that came back.

I think Gorka Morka is an ideal candidate for an one-off "all-in-one" box.



All that said, many of these games have been "released" by others to fill the gap in the market.
Forstgrave for Morheim
Deadzone for Necromunda (not so successfully imo)
Dropzone Commander for Epic (minus the massive walkers)
Dropfleet Commander for BFG
Dungeon Saga for WHQ.
Dreadball, Guild Ball for Blood Bowl (though other than being sports games they're not that similar imo)

It looks like GW have realised they've missed a mark with not having the smaller games, but whether they can take their market share back remains to be seen - for me they're going to have to be something special for me to shell out my cash (as they're likely to be more expensive than the above)>

[Milo]

(All of this is of course IF they re-release any games.)

As we still regularly play Necromunda and Mordheim I hope they don't change them much, if at all.

WHQ is a favourite as well, so would be happy to see that come back.

Never got into Epic or BFG, I'd rather see a return to the original Titan/Space Marines days (i.e. Epic mk1). Warmaster always held the same amount of interest for me as WFB i.e. none, so don't really care if that came back.

I think Gorka Morka is an ideal candidate for an one-off "all-in-one" box.

They're hiring for a rules writer, so I think there's undoubtedly some new rules/games releases coming.

I think that Necromunda and Mordheim could follow the BBRC route -- having a team of highly knowledgable and experienced player volunteers to help refine and improve the rules, but that like the BBRC, the emphasis would be on tweaks rather than wholesale replacement.

WHQ always was a quality game, and it did have expansion potential via new character packs. The crossover potential between WHQ models and WHFB also has potential, since they could source mini designs from WHFB for WHQ enemies and vice versa. (Plus if the boxed game is a good value, it could potentially be purchased as an army builder.)

Gorka Morka could be updated with new Trukks and Buggies and be purchased to build out 40k Ork armies, too.

[Darkson]

WHQ always was a quality game, and it did have expansion potential via new character packs. The crossover potential between WHQ models and WHFB also has potential, since they could source mini designs from WHFB for WHQ enemies and vice versa. (Plus if the boxed game is a good value, it could potentially be purchased as an army builder.)

I hope not, seeing as there is no WFB now, it's that Age of Sigmar rubbish, and if they source models from there it won't be WHQ anymore.

[mikeyc222]

I am most looking forward to new BB, Mordheim, Necromunda, and am interested in WHQ and Gorka Morka. At this point, I honestly don't care if they just release new models with the same rules, or do a complete rewrite on everything (as long as it isn't completely AoS'ed). I just want to see some new product on IPs that I love.

[frogboy]

BFG was good, only them Eldar Holo fields where broken as hell, unless you was packing a Nova Cannon.

Holofields gave a 2+ save vs Novacannon. It was cleared up in an FAQ. Holofields (and Dark Eldar Shadowfields) gave a 2+ save vs any attack that didnt use the gunnery/barrage table (this included teleport boarding attacks). The way to beat Eldar (either of them) was massive barrages of gunfire. Here's hoping they give a retreatment to BFG as well


And Epic. I love Epic.

Mmm maybe it was bombardment cannons then but with their move shoot move rules eldar ships where very hard to play against. I do seem to remember Nova Cannons being good for something and playing a game where I rolled nothing but hits on the scatter dice

[spubbbba]

WHQ always was a quality game, and it did have expansion potential via new character packs. The crossover potential between WHQ models and WHFB also has potential, since they could source mini designs from WHFB for WHQ enemies and vice versa. (Plus if the boxed game is a good value, it could potentially be purchased as an army builder.)

I think WHQ could be a great way to introduce new players to GW.

They would need to redo the boxed set as the old plastics are looking very dated now, but a general boxed set with standard plastic bad guys and some cool hero models would be awesome.
Then release themed expansions again, but this time with some normal enemies in plastic and a couple of unique characters.

[PercyTheTroll]

I suppose that for some of the fantasy games they'd need to at least update the fluff to reflect the AoS status quo. WQ for example is set in the same worl as WFB and seeing as they blew that up it'll need to be updated. Same for Warmaster and possibly Mighty Empires if they redo that (and they should because it was a lot of fun iirc) and any other games set in the Warhammer World.

Blood Bowl was always set in some sort of parallel version so it might not follow the AoS fluff, although I guess it could with teams travelling between the different realms to play. But whatever happens I guess the fluff will be brought up to date, just like it was between 2nd and 3rd Ed.

So my question is, what shape would that update take? Did the NAF get back on it's feet or did something else entirely happen?

[Milo]

I suppose that for some of the fantasy games they'd need to at least update the fluff to reflect the AoS status quo. WQ for example is set in the same worl as WFB and seeing as they blew that up it'll need to be updated. Same for Warmaster and possibly Mighty Empires if they redo that (and they should because it was a lot of fun iirc) and any other games set in the Warhammer World.

Blood Bowl was always set in some sort of parallel version so it might not follow the AoS fluff, although I guess it could with teams travelling between the different realms to play. But whatever happens I guess the fluff will be brought up to date, just like it was between 2nd and 3rd Ed.

So my question is, what shape would that update take? Did the NAF get back on it's feet or did something else entirely happen?

I don't think WHQ and Warmaster would necessarily need to be updated -- they could simply be set prior to the WH world blowing up, as the Horus Heresy is a different timeline from 40k. But I think a big part of the push for AOS was to make their IP less copyable by differentiating it from the standard elf/dwarf/orc tropes, so maybe.

I would hope no changes would be made to the BB setting, which was always unique.

I don't think this has anything to do with the NAF, but rather internal changes at GW. That said, I hope whomever gets the job would be willing to work with the NAF and Cyanide to bring some alignment into effect.

[rolo]

So my question is, what shape would that update take? Did the NAF get back on it's feet or did something else entirely happen?

I don't think this has anything to do with the NAF, but rather internal changes at GW. That said, I hope whomever gets the job would be willing to work with the NAF and Cyanide to bring some alignment into effect.

I think he was asking about the game-world NAF organization (the organization which collapsed and left hundreds of nomadic freelance teams barnstorming around the countryside, playing matches)

[DinoTitanedition]

It would be a pity if that part of the background would be changed, since it resembles the real tabletopplayers as coaches of their BloodBowl teams so much - we all travel around like a wandering circus to have our matches

[Dr. Von Richten]

No need to remove the KO, just tweaking the most broken events.
For example Blitz! could allow 1d6 players (or 1d3 + 1 maybe) or just the 2 players inside one of the wide-zones to perform actions,
while Pitch Invasion could just knock down players without stunning them (last time I suffered a Pitch Invasion I was playing Dwarfs vs Undead, so go figure how much fun is to be unable to properly defend for such event).
Random events should spice up the Kick Off, but not impacting too severely the match.

Except many of us don't think those events are broken. To lessen their impact would make the game more dull. For me the variation you can see on a BB pitch, and the tactical decisions it can force you into, is part of the game. Early Blitz against? Forced to try to score more. Pitch invasion not go your way? Deal with the bad opening position. If you want something which is far more serious and with less randomness then I recommend Frozen Cortex, but it's not as if a BB match is a matter of life and death.

Last World Cup in Lucca, I played Necro. One match I faced Wood Elves, got a Blitz against and was 0-1 down at my 2nd turn ... I won that match 3-2.

Even unfavorable matchups and unfortunate Kick-Off events need not spell doom for your side, which is one of the things I like about Blood Bowl.

Another thing I like is this: we have this one guy at our local league, who really is a bad player. Very little insight in positioning, risk-management, planning ahead etc. However, once in a while, usually because the dice really go his way, he will draw or even win a match, and that's what makes the game fun for him too.

Being able to pull of a victory against a player who is significantly better than you is pretty cool and empowering, even if luck plays an essential part in that victory, and I'm willing to suffer the occasional defeat by players who are less good than I am (not that I'm that good myself) as a consequence of that randomness.