Vampires

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 1:43 am

Zombie wrote:No, that's not what i'm saying. It has nothing to do with being able to replace the lord. It has to do with being set back too much by the loss of the lesser vamp, so you're better off restarting anyway.

What i'm saying is that whether you can replace the lord or have to disband is irrelevant if you're gonna retire the team anyway.

right i agree totally...no point continuing the team when the lord dies no matter WHAT is left. it will forever be a lesser team.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 1:49 am

I dunno, if my lord died in my MBBL team I've a "lesser" Vamp lined up to take his place, but there again, I did start with 3 or 4 lessers (didn't trust the thralls.)

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 2:34 am

On an established team, it wouldn't be as big of a deal. On a beginnig team, you just lost a 110K player! That's a significant setback. Start the team over.

Mirascael · Post by **Mirascael** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 3:05 am

wesleytj wrote:
Zombie wrote:No, that's not what i'm saying. It has nothing to do with being able to replace the lord. It has to do with being set back too much by the loss of the lesser vamp, so you're better off restarting anyway.

What i'm saying is that whether you can replace the lord or have to disband is irrelevant if you're gonna retire the team anyway.
right i agree totally...no point continuing the team when the lord dies no matter WHAT is left. it will forever be a lesser team.

Wes, one of your lesser vampires is automatically promoted to become the new lord in case your former lord dies!

Cervidal · Post by **Cervidal** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 3:17 am

I can't believe what I'm hearing...

Blatantly restarting a team because of a bad result is poor form. That a team has an auto-retire mechanism built right in only makes my head shake that much more.

That is really my biggest problem with open-style leages. It leads to conversations like I'm reading right now. Don't like how your team played out in the first three games? Start another! Hooey, says I.

Smeborg · Post by **Smeborg** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 3:42 am

Thanks, Cervidal, I couldn't say it better myself.

Where are the real coaches out there? What's all this "retire the side" nonsense? The most enjoyable side I ever ran in a league dropped to a team rating of 87.5 at one point (might have been 84.5. - I can't remember). They recovered after another 5 or 6 games. And I loved them for it. It's not unusual for sides in leagues to drop to a TRR of around 90. But no way should they retire. Soldier on!

I was shocked in a tournament recently, when my opponent retired his side after our game (it was a mini-league format). I mean, I had killed only one of his team, and Seriously Injured one or two others (I remember with some pleasure that I reduced the MA of a Gutter Runner). But his side was in better shape than many a side that I've soldiered on with. And this coach was not going to place in the tournament - in his shoes, I'd have gained far more pleasure from carrying on.

Any good (or just half-decent) coach should relish the challenge of recovering from a good kicking!

Cheers

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 3:55 am

Really, i don't see what's the big deal with retiring teams. To me, it's just a strategic move like any other. Maybe you guys can enlighten me?

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 4:42 am

I don't see a problem with it either. I started a lizzie team in the REBBL and had no idea what I was doing. My first match Darkson's Norse showed me the error of my ways and really put a hurt on them. Instead of having no fun and not learning anything about Lizardmen I chose to hit the reset button. More fun for me and more fun for my next few opponents...as long as they aren't 12 year old turds who enjoy ruining teams.

That said, I don't like the idea of coaches starting over just because they lost twice or didn't like their skill rolls.

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 5:26 am

Mestari · Post by **Mestari** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 6:46 am

As a general rule, I dislike people retiring teams. However, under certain situations I sympathise with them. Team needs to be hurt badly enough and continuing them should be pointless. Pariah's situation above is something that I'd probably approve.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 7:30 am

To be fair to Pariah, Nuffle was looking down favourably for that game, even by 2D you choose blocks against his Saurus were knocking him over. I think he would have started the next game with 7-8 player, with 2 suffering SI with stat decreases.
In the same league I retired both my CD's and HE teams. I hadn't enjoyed playing CD's, so took on the biggest team in the league. I had my ass handed to me on a plate, but the team went out in a blaze of glory (well, in a wooden box actually). I retired the HE's as I just couldn't get their playing style right, and after 4 straight losses (I due to Handicap roll of 6 players delayed for 1st half) the team had 8 fit players and 3 MNG, with 2 stat decreases, and a FF of 4 or 5. Plus I rolled lots of 1's, and didn't enjoy myself.
In my last game before the close season, I played a DE coach who retired the team after the game. He'd never played elves before, and although he had the on-pitch stuff OK, he wasn't to hot on the off-field management, and had started the team with FF3 and no RR, prefering 3 or 4 posistonal players. After a 4-0 TD, 4-0 CAS drubbing he retired the team and went back to his Chaos team, though I think he was going to start a new DE for the next season.

As for the vampire team, I've no problem people having to retire them if their only Vampire dies, after all it's a vampire team, and the thralls are meant to be under the Lord's power.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 8:36 am

Yeah Nuffle was either mad at me or happy with you!

Cervidal · Post by **Cervidal** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 12:08 pm

Retiring teams because you don't like them is one thing. Retiring a Wood Elf team because they had a player die in the opening match is another.

Retiring a team because of disadvantage purposes reeks of unsportsman-like conduct. You were beaten because of a lack of skill, lack of knowledge, or plain luck. In any of those three cases, suck it up and prove yourself the better coach by winning at such a disadvantage. How is a coach ever going to get better if s/he doesn't play through adversity?

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 6:54 pm

How is it unsportmanlike to want to have to same chance as your opponent? Again, you're not coming close to convincing me here.

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Tue Mar 18, 2003 7:00 pm

I've got to agree with Zombie, here. Why bother to continue with a broken team? When your best player is killed or crippled in your opening game, sometimes you just don't want to play that team any more. As long as you're not scheduled to play a season with them, I don't have a problem retiring them.

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Vampires

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