Grumbledook wrote:Or am i reading the tables wrong?
Its a bit difficult when I'm supposed to be working...Blood Bowl Results By Race
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DoubleSkulls
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wesleytj
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Nah, you're reading too much into too small a set of statistics. I'm sure all it meant that the dark elves there were less well coached or something. I'm also quite sure that wood elves are better than they appear there as well, and that humans and chaos dwarves particularly aren't as good. They were just well coached.martynq wrote:It seems to say: Choose your team in the following sequence...
Undead, Chaos Dwarf, Human, Amazon, Orc, Dwarf, Skaven or Wood Elf, Chaos or High Elf, Norse, Lizardmen, Dark Elf, Goblin, Halfling.
Still early days, I guess, but are dark elf really the worst out of the serious teams? (No wonder, I lose so often with them then!)
Martyn
Also, remember the tourney format is at/near tr 100. some teams get better as they go, some teams are better early on...which is a reason i'm surprised norse aren't higher too...they are usually a good tr100 team with all the blk.
Just goes to show how important coaching skill and luck is.
Now, if you were to get a much bigger sample of games, to the point that other elements like coaching skill and dice even out due to increased sample size, then you'd get good data on actual races and balance and what not. And I think you'd find most of the races (besides gobs and flings) right around .500, which is of course the goal.
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Smeborg
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Some thoughts on the stats
The stats from the Blood Bowl will not be 100% reliable. Some coaches took Star Players, others didn't. Also, some teams are under-represented statistically.
Another source of stats is to look at the average NAF rankings of sides. This shows a broadly similar picture, with Undead in front, closely followed by Chaos Dwarfs. However, this time Skaven are in (distant) 3rd place, I think.
I am not surprised that Undead and Chaos Dwarfs do well in tournament play. They have the best defence (look at the TDs against column). BB is won or lost in defence.
Sadly it looks like the Chaos Dwarfs lost to the Undead every time they played each other. I say "sadly" because I played Chaos Dwarfs, but thought long and hard about taking Undead before the tournament.
Cheers
Another source of stats is to look at the average NAF rankings of sides. This shows a broadly similar picture, with Undead in front, closely followed by Chaos Dwarfs. However, this time Skaven are in (distant) 3rd place, I think.
I am not surprised that Undead and Chaos Dwarfs do well in tournament play. They have the best defence (look at the TDs against column). BB is won or lost in defence.
Sadly it looks like the Chaos Dwarfs lost to the Undead every time they played each other. I say "sadly" because I played Chaos Dwarfs, but thought long and hard about taking Undead before the tournament.
Cheers
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These are only games between NAF coaches (otherwise there would be twice as many results). This is because the GW results don't indicate race, but the NAF ones do. Given that its 2/3 of the field its a fair enough representation.Deathwing wrote:And this is just all NAF results, right?
BTW you don't have a race down for mozingerz.
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I'm surprised to see Amazons doing so well given the star player environment and their famous lack of star players....
To be honest, the Blood Bowl only showed me one thing... if you really, really want to win, take a human team with Griff & Luthor..
If you want to get the best laugh of your life.. take a goblin fanatic and shout out loud and proud...
PS Woody, I like your BBSpotting soundtrack very much... not sure you have the right accent though...
To be honest, the Blood Bowl only showed me one thing... if you really, really want to win, take a human team with Griff & Luthor..
If you want to get the best laugh of your life.. take a goblin fanatic and shout out loud and proud...
PS Woody, I like your BBSpotting soundtrack very much... not sure you have the right accent though...
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[/quote]
Possibly: A Fair few inexperienced coaches took Skaven
2: Team selection in this kinda tourney is crucial, i played one Skaven coach who took no Headsplitter and 2 Gutter Runners. When it was me to receive the Gutter Runners sat in the reserves. When he finally got a turn with the ball there were only about 8 fit Players.
[/quote]
Give me break MCdeth, i failed a gfi roll with my g,runner in the 2nd turn if the 2nd half when he had the ball that would have seem him out of touch, and through to score, i hate star players so no HEADSPLITTER and waht would have been the point in putting my g.runners on in defence in the first half like they were going to get the ball from Luthor with his bodyguard of 2 mummies and 4 wights.
Next time we meet you`ll see how inexperienced this coach is when i wipe your team clean off the pitch. Consider a grudge match.
P.S. No hard feelings really, didnt realise you were a TBB`er when we played. To be honest in hindsight i would take more G.Runners. actually to honest i probbably would n`t take skaven, i guess i i`d take undead any fool can play well with them
Possibly: A Fair few inexperienced coaches took Skaven
2: Team selection in this kinda tourney is crucial, i played one Skaven coach who took no Headsplitter and 2 Gutter Runners. When it was me to receive the Gutter Runners sat in the reserves. When he finally got a turn with the ball there were only about 8 fit Players.
[/quote]
Give me break MCdeth, i failed a gfi roll with my g,runner in the 2nd turn if the 2nd half when he had the ball that would have seem him out of touch, and through to score, i hate star players so no HEADSPLITTER and waht would have been the point in putting my g.runners on in defence in the first half like they were going to get the ball from Luthor with his bodyguard of 2 mummies and 4 wights. Next time we meet you`ll see how inexperienced this coach is when i wipe your team clean off the pitch. Consider a grudge match.
P.S. No hard feelings really, didnt realise you were a TBB`er when we played. To be honest in hindsight i would take more G.Runners. actually to honest i probbably would n`t take skaven, i guess i i`d take undead any fool can play well with them
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DoubleSkulls
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Okay I've ironed out a few bugs so here's the final list.
Code: Select all
Summary
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Amazons 18 8 2 8 0.44 0.11 0.44 25 23 2
Chaos 18 6 6 6 0.33 0.33 0.33 21 21 0
Chaos Dwarves 36 21 0 15 0.58 0.00 0.42 56 39 17
Dark Elves 13 3 4 6 0.23 0.31 0.46 18 21 -3
Dwarves 30 11 8 11 0.37 0.27 0.37 40 43 -3
Goblins 11 2 0 9 0.18 0.00 0.82 11 27 -16
Halflings 15 1 3 11 0.07 0.20 0.73 16 33 -17
High Elves 6 2 3 1 0.33 0.50 0.17 8 7 1
Humans 45 23 6 16 0.51 0.13 0.36 77 55 22
Lizardmen 26 7 6 13 0.27 0.23 0.50 29 47 -18
Norse 14 4 1 9 0.29 0.07 0.64 16 24 -8
Orc 74 28 15 31 0.38 0.20 0.42 84 108 -24
Skaven 52 19 12 21 0.37 0.23 0.40 92 89 3
Undead 52 30 11 11 0.58 0.21 0.21 77 49 28
Wood Elves 40 16 11 13 0.40 0.28 0.32 93 77 16
Amazons
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 18 8 2 8 0.44 0.11 0.44 25 23 2
Chaos Dwarves 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 4 -4
Dark Elves 3 1 0 2 0.33 0.00 0.67 5 4 1
Goblins 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Halflings 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 4 0 4
Humans 3 1 1 1 0.33 0.33 0.33 5 5 0
Lizardmen 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 1 0 1
Orc 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 2 1 1
Skaven 2 1 0 1 0.50 0.00 0.50 3 2 1
Wood Elves 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 3 6 -3
Chaos
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 18 6 6 6 0.33 0.33 0.33 21 21 0
Chaos Dwarves 2 1 0 1 0.50 0.00 0.50 2 3 -1
Halflings 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Humans 1 0 1 0 0.00 1.00 0.00 1 1 0
Lizardmen 2 1 0 1 0.50 0.00 0.50 2 2 0
Norse 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 1 -1
Orc 6 3 1 2 0.50 0.17 0.33 9 6 3
Skaven 2 0 2 0 0.00 1.00 0.00 3 3 0
Undead 3 0 2 1 0.00 0.67 0.33 2 4 -2
Chaos Dwarves
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 36 21 0 15 0.58 0.00 0.42 56 39 17
Amazons 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 4 0 4
Chaos 2 1 0 1 0.50 0.00 0.50 3 2 1
Dwarves 3 3 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 6 2 4
Goblins 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 0 2
High Elves 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Humans 3 2 0 1 0.67 0.00 0.33 5 2 3
Lizardmen 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Norse 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 4 0 4
Orc 5 4 0 1 0.80 0.00 0.20 8 2 6
Skaven 3 2 0 1 0.67 0.00 0.33 6 4 2
Undead 3 0 0 3 0.00 0.00 1.00 3 6 -3
Wood Elves 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 3 7 -4
Dark Elves
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 13 3 4 6 0.23 0.31 0.46 18 21 -3
Amazons 3 2 0 1 0.67 0.00 0.33 4 5 -1
Halflings 1 0 1 0 0.00 1.00 0.00 3 3 0
Orc 4 1 0 3 0.25 0.00 0.75 6 5 1
Skaven 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 2 -2
Undead 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 1 2 -1
Dwarves
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 30 11 8 11 0.37 0.27 0.37 40 43 -3
Chaos Dwarves 3 0 0 3 0.00 0.00 1.00 2 6 -4
Goblins 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 5 1 4
Halflings 3 2 1 0 0.67 0.33 0.00 6 3 3
Humans 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 2 -2
Lizardmen 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 3 2 1
Norse 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 0 2
Orc 5 2 2 1 0.40 0.40 0.20 5 5 0
Skaven 5 1 3 1 0.20 0.60 0.20 8 8 0
Undead 4 1 0 3 0.25 0.00 0.75 3 6 -3
Wood Elves 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 2 6 -4
Goblins
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 11 2 0 9 0.18 0.00 0.82 11 27 -16
Amazons 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Chaos Dwarves 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 2 -2
Dwarves 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 5 -4
Humans 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Lizardmen 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 0 2
Norse 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Orc 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 7 -6
Skaven 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 2 4 -2
Wood Elves 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 4 -3
Halflings
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 15 1 3 11 0.07 0.20 0.73 16 33 -17
Amazons 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 4 -4
Chaos 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Dark Elves 1 0 1 0 0.00 1.00 0.00 3 3 0
Dwarves 3 0 1 2 0.00 0.33 0.67 3 6 -3
Humans 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 3 -2
Orc 5 0 1 4 0.00 0.20 0.80 5 11 -6
Skaven 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 3 -2
Wood Elves 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
High Elves
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 6 2 3 1 0.33 0.50 0.17 8 7 1
Chaos Dwarves 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Orc 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 0 3 -3
Wood Elves 3 1 2 0 0.33 0.67 0.00 6 3 3
Humans
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 45 23 6 16 0.51 0.13 0.36 77 55 22
Amazons 3 1 1 1 0.33 0.33 0.33 5 5 0
Chaos 1 0 1 0 0.00 1.00 0.00 1 1 0
Chaos Dwarves 3 1 0 2 0.33 0.00 0.67 2 5 -3
Dwarves 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 0 2
Goblins 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Halflings 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 3 1 2
Lizardmen 3 1 0 2 0.33 0.00 0.67 4 4 0
Norse 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 5 2 3
Orc 8 5 1 2 0.62 0.12 0.25 16 4 12
Skaven 4 3 0 1 0.75 0.00 0.25 11 3 8
Undead 9 3 2 4 0.33 0.22 0.44 11 12 -1
Wood Elves 3 1 1 1 0.33 0.33 0.33 6 8 -2
Lizardmen
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 26 7 6 13 0.27 0.23 0.50 29 47 -18
Amazons 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 1 -1
Chaos 2 1 0 1 0.50 0.00 0.50 2 2 0
Chaos Dwarves 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Dwarves 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 2 3 -1
Goblins 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 2 -2
Humans 3 2 0 1 0.67 0.00 0.33 4 4 0
Orc 6 1 3 2 0.17 0.50 0.33 7 9 -2
Skaven 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 3 5 -2
Undead 3 0 1 2 0.00 0.33 0.67 2 6 -4
Wood Elves 5 2 0 3 0.40 0.00 0.60 7 14 -7
Norse
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 14 4 1 9 0.29 0.07 0.64 16 24 -8
Chaos 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 1 0 1
Chaos Dwarves 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 4 -4
Dwarves 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 2 -2
Goblins 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Humans 2 0 0 2 0.00 0.00 1.00 2 5 -3
Skaven 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 1 0 1
Undead 4 2 0 2 0.50 0.00 0.50 8 5 3
Wood Elves 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 3 6 -3
Orc
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 74 28 15 31 0.38 0.20 0.42 84 108 -24
Amazons 2 0 1 1 0.00 0.50 0.50 1 2 -1
Chaos 6 2 1 3 0.33 0.17 0.50 6 9 -3
Chaos Dwarves 5 1 0 4 0.20 0.00 0.80 2 8 -6
Dark Elves 4 3 0 1 0.75 0.00 0.25 5 6 -1
Dwarves 5 1 2 2 0.20 0.40 0.40 5 5 0
Goblins 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 7 1 6
Halflings 5 4 1 0 0.80 0.20 0.00 11 5 6
High Elves 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 3 0 3
Humans 8 2 1 5 0.25 0.12 0.62 4 16 -12
Lizardmen 6 2 3 1 0.33 0.50 0.17 9 7 2
Skaven 16 7 2 7 0.44 0.12 0.44 21 31 -10
Undead 6 0 1 5 0.00 0.17 0.83 4 13 -9
Wood Elves 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 1 1
Skaven
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 52 19 12 21 0.37 0.23 0.40 92 89 3
Amazons 2 1 0 1 0.50 0.00 0.50 2 3 -1
Chaos 2 0 2 0 0.00 1.00 0.00 3 3 0
Chaos Dwarves 3 1 0 2 0.33 0.00 0.67 4 6 -2
Dark Elves 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 2 0 2
Dwarves 5 1 3 1 0.20 0.60 0.20 8 8 0
Goblins 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 4 2 2
Halflings 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 3 1 2
Humans 4 1 0 3 0.25 0.00 0.75 3 11 -8
Lizardmen 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 5 3 2
Norse 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 0 1 -1
Orc 16 7 2 7 0.44 0.12 0.44 31 21 10
Undead 3 0 1 2 0.00 0.33 0.67 2 5 -3
Wood Elves 9 3 3 3 0.33 0.33 0.33 22 22 0
Undead
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 52 30 11 11 0.58 0.21 0.21 77 49 28
Chaos 3 1 2 0 0.33 0.67 0.00 4 2 2
Chaos Dwarves 3 3 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 6 3 3
Dark Elves 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 2 1 1
Dwarves 4 3 0 1 0.75 0.00 0.25 6 3 3
Humans 9 4 2 3 0.44 0.22 0.33 12 11 1
Lizardmen 3 2 1 0 0.67 0.33 0.00 6 2 4
Norse 4 2 0 2 0.50 0.00 0.50 5 8 -3
Orc 6 5 1 0 0.83 0.17 0.00 13 4 9
Skaven 3 2 1 0 0.67 0.33 0.00 5 2 3
Wood Elves 3 2 1 0 0.67 0.33 0.00 8 3 5
Wood Elves
Pld W D L W% D% L% For Ag Net
Overall 40 16 11 13 0.40 0.28 0.32 93 77 16
Amazons 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 6 3 3
Chaos Dwarves 2 2 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 7 3 4
Dwarves 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 6 2 4
Goblins 1 1 0 0 1.00 0.00 0.00 4 1 3
Halflings 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
High Elves 3 0 2 1 0.00 0.67 0.33 3 6 -3
Humans 3 1 1 1 0.33 0.33 0.33 8 6 2
Lizardmen 5 3 0 2 0.60 0.00 0.40 14 7 7
Norse 2 1 1 0 0.50 0.50 0.00 6 3 3
Orc 1 0 0 1 0.00 0.00 1.00 1 2 -1
Skaven 9 3 3 3 0.33 0.33 0.33 22 22 0
Undead 3 0 1 2 0.00 0.33 0.67 3 8 -5
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