Orc Team Progression

[Mortalman]

Hi,
I'm new to this forum (but not to Bloodbowl) so be nice

I'm currently playing in a league with occasional tournaments, so team are hanging around for a good while. I started with:
4 Black Orcs
2 Blitzers
1 Thrower
1 Goblin
4 Linemen
3 Re-rolls
3 Fan Factor

I've now added an Ogre, a Blitzer, 1 Re-roll, an apothecary and my FF is currently 9.

As the team has gone on, and done fairly well, I've noticed a few things I need advice on.

1) I'm developing a nasty front line (3 out of 4 black orcs have block) but most of my players have no skills and paltry SPPs. Is it the fate of Orcs to have a couple of super start players (thrower and Blitzers) or is should I make more of an effort to spread the TDs around?

2) While of Defence I'm pretty hot (a few players with tackle and a generally tough team has meant I haven't conceded a TD in 3 games and only 1 in the last 6!) my offensive play is not really progressing. I can do a cage, but it doesn't really work against hard teams and I usually have to rely on an opponent making a mistake a blitzer can exploit. Is there anything I can do to spice things up?

3) I've always held to the idea that stunned is good enough, so I concentrate on knocking other players over and staying up myself rather than injuring players - ie I'm taking block, tackle, pro etc rather than mighty blow, piling on and Dirty Player. Is this a worth while idea?

4) I'm running out of linemen! I now only have 3 and I don't really feel like buying another one back. I do use them to soak up damage from big stuff but I'm now tempted to fill the gaps in the roster with another Blitzer, another Goblin, perhaps another thrower (cos while Grimfang is top notch he's got a lot of SPP and I'm worried about him ageing) and so on - will I miss the expendable guys?

5) You'll have noticed I have the two pre-requisites of the Lob-a-Gob play (an Ogre and a Goblin) is it worth working on my air-bourne attack? I haven't tried it yet, especially since I'm rather attached to my goblin, he's the only player on my team who can catch and also the only one the ref doesn't notice putting the boot in!

Sorry for the long post but, any ideas?

[Grumbledook]

Well orcs can get a lot of position players, so its not so important for them to have a lot of linemen. You should definatly have all 4 blitzers though. These are your best players and are most adaptable. Maybe you could try using misdirection running a couple of players down the side away from your cage, with the threat of passing to them.

Saving up for another reoll could be useful as well, they also help should you want to use more of a flair play than the cage. Though having said that orcs use the cage to best effect, sounds like your on the right track, so just carry on with what your doing as far as i can see ;]

Oh and welcome to the board ;]

[DoubleSkulls]

I'd say the 4th blitzer and 2nd thrower should be your top priority. BOBs pickup SPPs at a reasonable pace once they have Block.

As for you offensive problems - this is one area that those injury inflicting skills help. Getting a few opponents off the pitch really helps open up your offensive options and increase you scoring. The other thing to do is has a decent passing game - this ought to make your opponent spread his defence between the running cage and your odd receiver.

[Mortalman]

The other thing to do is has a decent passing game - this ought to make your opponent spread his defence between the running cage and your odd receiver.

I'd like to get this going, as I'm playing against fairly able opponents and they won't divert too much attention towards an obvious feint so I need a real threat of a pass. What I'm unsure of is the way to go - do I aim to throw to my gobbo/blitzers and run for it or chuck the goblin with my Ogre? What skills should I be taking to set this up?

So far my team has mostly taken defensive skills (tackle/block) because I haven't rolled a single double yet for any of my skill rolls.

[Ork Dreadnought]

Hmm, I'm gonna go a little off topic here while sticking to the theme.

I've noted no one ever mentions the team boxset when starting anew. Why is this the case?

[Fronko]

Well, if you really want to create a catcher, then make a blitzer take catch or - even better - Nerves of steel. Well, this means using up a double on a blitzer (two, if you want both skills), but then you have your catcher.

Then cage down one side and battle two blitzers through on the other. Either you will succeed with your cage tactic or if the opponent stops that drive, he perhaps won´t have enough players to stop your catcher from breaking away (back up with guard blitzer!).

[DoubleSkulls]

I've noted no one ever mentions the team boxset when starting anew. Why is this the case?

You mean basing team selection on the available models? Most serious players will either already have all the minis they need, or be willing to fork out the money for a couple extra.

Last time I ordered one of the boxed sets - The Galadrieth Gladiators - I ended up being sent loose minis anyway.

[Mortalman]

The plastic set with Bloodbowl is a pretty awful Orc team - it ignores one of their main strengths: access to lots of cheap postion players! It has only 2 BOs and 2 BZs, no goblins and a load of linemen. My team (outlined in the original post) shows what you can squeeze out of 1000000 GPs - assuming you don't take star players of course. I made my own team from the position players in the Orcland Raiders set (I had to get duplicates to fill up my BOs and BZs slots though) and linemen made out of 40k ard boyz. Team looks MEAN!

[wesleytj]

Hi,
I'm new to this forum (but not to Bloodbowl) so be nice

Welcome to the club!!

I'm currently playing in a league with occasional tournaments, so team are hanging around for a good while. I started with:
4 Black Orcs
2 Blitzers
1 Thrower
1 Goblin
4 Linemen
3 Re-rolls
3 Fan Factor

I would have gotten rid of the 4th line orc in favor of a fan factor of 8. Orcs have enough armor that they don't really need to start at tr 100 with a bench, and that extra FF would have helped you make more money as your team went on. (not to mention winning those nasty pitch invasion rolls!)

I also probably would have gone 3/3 with the black orcs and blitzers instead of 4/2 but that's very debateable. Blitzers are your best players for scoring and very versatile on defense as well.

I've now added an Ogre, a Blitzer, 1 Re-roll, an apothecary and my FF is currently 9.

As the team has gone on, and done fairly well, I've noticed a few things I need advice on.

Sounds like your're doing quite well if you have increased your FF that much. Well done!

1) I'm developing a nasty front line (3 out of 4 black orcs have block) but most of my players have no skills and paltry SPPs. Is it the fate of Orcs to have a couple of super start players (thrower and Blitzers) or is should I make more of an effort to spread the TDs around?.

Well the reason you're not getting spp elsewhere will be partly explained below. Also don't forget your goblin. He can score td's as well, and I don't necessarily mean by throwing him.

2) While of Defence I'm pretty hot (a few players with tackle and a generally tough team has meant I haven't conceded a TD in 3 games and only 1 in the last 6!) my offensive play is not really progressing. I can do a cage, but it doesn't really work against hard teams and I usually have to rely on an opponent making a mistake a blitzer can exploit. Is there anything I can do to spice things up?

Sounds like your defense is GREAT!:)

I was always better playing defense with orcs than offense as well...I think they're better suited to that. There are SOME things you can do though. It sounds like you're suffering from not having enough blitzers...get up to 4 asap, and find creative ways to use your goblin (unless you face teams with a lot of tackle), they can really create problems for opponents.

3) I've always held to the idea that stunned is good enough, so I concentrate on knocking other players over and staying up myself rather than injuring players - ie I'm taking block, tackle, pro etc rather than mighty blow, piling on and Dirty Player. Is this a worth while idea?

Well that might be why your non-scoring players aren't getting many spps. Having Mighty Blow on your black orcs really helps them get some casualties...and honestly how else are black orcs going to get spps reliably?

Line orcs are a different matter, the best way to get them spps is by feeding them touchdowns, but to be honest you don't really need them built up anymore anyway. As you've noticed, line orcs tend to get used less and less as your team improves. 4 black orcs, 4 blitzers, an ogre, a thrower, and a goblin is 11 players.

4) I'm running out of linemen! I now only have 3 and I don't really feel like buying another one back. I do use them to soak up damage from big stuff but I'm now tempted to fill the gaps in the roster with another Blitzer, another Goblin, perhaps another thrower (cos while Grimfang is top notch he's got a lot of SPP and I'm worried about him ageing) and so on - will I miss the expendable guys?

Nope...don't worry about it. Get your position players and go with it.

5) You'll have noticed I have the two pre-requisites of the Lob-a-Gob play (an Ogre and a Goblin) is it worth working on my air-bourne attack? I haven't tried it yet, especially since I'm rather attached to my goblin, he's the only player on my team who can catch and also the only one the ref doesn't notice putting the boot in!

Well, if you're attached to your current goblin, buy another one. It's a great way to spend that 1 turn before the half or end of game when you're recieving the ball and don't have anything better to do. If it fails, no big deal, nothing ventured nothing lost right?

Sorry for the long post but, any ideas?

don't worry about it, i do long posts ALL the time. Hope you find this one somewhat useful.

[Amon242]

While we are on the subject of throwing goblins. Anyone want to fill me in on the in's and out's of TTM? I just started an Orc team and I am unsure how to use it. Is it worth developing? Can you throw goblins on defense?

[Grumbledook]

Do you not have the living rulebook, all the rules are in there. Basically you can use ttm instead of that turns passing action. So you can throw a goblin on all of your turns if you want.

[Amon242]

Yea, I read the LRB about throwin a team mate. There is a diffrence between what a rule book says and what is the best way to use it in game situations. I see you can't use it on defense, so I assume its only good for trying to get a 1 turn score?

[Grumbledook]

What makes you think you can't use it on defence. Sometimes it might be your only way of getting a player to their ball carrier. You can also use it to hope a scattered throw lands on one of their players causeing a knockdown.

[DoubleSkulls]

Yea, I read the LRB about throwin a team mate. There is a diffrence between what a rule book says and what is the best way to use it in game situations. I see you can't use it on defense, so I assume its only good for trying to get a 1 turn score?

If you TTM a goblin and he fails his landing roll, then its only a turnover if he is carrying the ball. So the theory is that its a more reliable play on defence.

There is an argument with an Orc team that you get a couple of goblins with diving tackle and side step, lob them downfield and watch the pesky ball carrier panic because he can't dodge away, and maybe he'll difficulty blitzing you too (especially if he doesn't have a Block/Tackle handy because they are all too far away).

Even if he does blitz the goblin that means he hasn't used the blitz to put a hole in your line. Still its not a great play because of fumbles, scattering and goblins squish themselves quite easily, but still more likely to work than the 1 turner.

[BadMrMojo]

What makes you think you can't use it on defence. Sometimes it might be your only way of getting a player to their ball carrier. You can also use it to hope a scattered throw lands on one of their players causeing a knockdown.

I'm going to go out on a limb and say that there is no play in BB that is more fun that actually trying to have your TTM scatter to knock down a ball carrier and have it work.

Chucking little guys downfield to either harrass ball carriers (on defense, especially good on blitzes) or sit and wait for a long pass (on offense) are both perfectly good options, so long as you don't really expect them to work reliably. Throwing them into the middle of a cage can be a fun way to knock down an opening, and leave you with a Blitz action, too.

You can throw a TM without the ball whenever you like. It's particularly useful if the stunty hasn't moved yet, as you can then stand him up if he's fallen (and not stunned or worse) and either move or even blitz. The only caveats are the ones you noticed: IF the stunty has the ball (it doesn't say your team needs to have possession) the a failed landing or fumble results in a turnover and obviously, that you go through a lot of gobbos that way . You can even move your Ogre next to your stunty AND put him into one or more TZs in the hopes that your throw will be off and land on someone. Be warned, though, that the penalties from the TZs make it much more likely to fumble the wee fellow though.

Just play around with it and see what you come up with. It's not statistically sound in most cases, but it sure is funny.