Tactics on Skaven teams

Marcus · Post by **Marcus** » Tue Oct 22, 2002 9:23 am

The opponents I usually meet don't play so that they have to count on a turnover in order to win. Instead they block your LOS down and run deep i turn 1 creating a sort of wall of players and tackle zones around their ball carrier.

Then, in all seriousness, your opponents aren't that good. The players I play against will, given the setup you suggested, do exactly what martyn suggested, as well as running recievers further downfield. You'd be left both decent field position and the distinct possibility (roughly 1 in 3 if he's got block, 1 in 2 if he hasn't) that the Ratogre will force you to miss your entire next turn.

Now, if you set up like that every drive, it's going to happen to you. If your opponent was coaching Orcs, Dwarves, Chaos, Undead, or something else suitably bashy, they've just had 2 turns back to back. They have every possibility of getting every last skaven on your team on the ground &/or off the pitch. Even if they didn't then they'd have a guaranteed touchdown if they wanted to take it. Personally, against skaven I'd be saying don't bother scoring quickly, use your free turn to set up your players however you like and smack the warpstone out of every last rat in sight.

Frankly, I think you've been lucky not to lose every game.

Icedman · Post by **Icedman** » Thu Oct 24, 2002 8:09 am

Hey guys,
New to the forum (at least as a member), but I just had to put in my 2c worth on this one. The last league me and my friends (8 of us in total) played I took an experimental Beastman team (not sure where it came from, but I can give you stats if you're interested) and started with a Minotaur. After 30 games' experience, I must say that I can definitely see both sides of this argument.

I started setting up the Mino on the LoS; it takes the average (note here; AVERAGE) coach a couple games to recognise that a WA can be manipulated the way you guys are saying (this I know from experience). That being said, however, he managed to crack the 40 SPP mark (all CAS except for 2 MVPs) by the end of the league; better than the Undead guy's Mummies.

Conversely, in the current league, I've taken Skaven. And I don't have a RO, because I chose not to start with him. And I'm not going to buy one, either.

I suppose that what 'm trying to say is: if you want a WA on your team, you'd best start with him, or get him ASAP (the only chance I had where I even considered it was my Skaven's 3rd game) because he really, REALLY needs to get those SPP's rolling in. And secondly, yes, set him up on the LoS, but the SECOND your opponent wises up to it, get him off the line; make your opponent have to move guys to him if they want to try and get him to kill himself. Finally, don't be afraid to leave him sitting on the bench for important drives; that way, your opponent can't force a turnover by swamping your WA.

l_dauguet · Post by **l_dauguet** » Mon Oct 28, 2002 6:08 pm

i maybe have missed a post but if WA don't get assists in their blocks or blitz, the player they block can't get assist either 'coz of the WA skill.
that's what i have in my rules.of course, when aplyer block your RO in his turn he can get assists.
also, i'm a rookie skaven coach and i must say that i have FUN playing my RO. even if i get the 2 skulls more than i deserve (3 times in a row!!!!!) but i won that game anyway 'coz i had planed a little something with my trhower and my GR.
besides, saying what skills shuold be given to what player, i think you don't chose your rolls (like for the double skulls!!!!!)
it's nice to say give your vermin this or your GR that, but if you don't make doubles, too bad. there're a ot of interseting skills in the available list. jump or sprint for GR or block for linerats or mighty blow for vermin.
if you can get better, you're lucky. if you can't you still have good players.
i don't expect to have more than 2 or 3 mutations in my team.
but my team will evolve with its players.
1 of my linerats has block, i use it like a vermin since i only have 1.
you should adapt yourself to the game. not making plans before starting playing.

just a few words from a rookie coach that would take any advice from people of good will.

Khrage · Post by **Khrage** » Mon Oct 28, 2002 7:07 pm

No it is just the WA that can't get any offensive assists. The opponent can assist up all he wants.

I will also say that ROs are some of the funnest players in the league, even with WA. And when they are well painted they are some of the coolest figs out there.

Icedman I see where you are coming from and I agree with you that as long as your fellow coaches aren't wising up to it, I can see useing him on the line effectively. And the point about not being afraid to leave him off the pitch is a good one. I love seeing a 5 str monstrosity in the reserves because of the other coaches fear! Just gives me all sorts of warm fuzzies.

l_dauguet · Post by **l_dauguet** » Mon Oct 28, 2002 9:05 pm

apparently we don't play with the same rules. in mine it is stated clearly that a plyer blocked by a WA can't get assists.
as long as all the people from the league agree on the rules it's fine.

i defenitly agree with you. a painted RO is defenitly cool.
but when is sitting on the bench...is he just watching the game or is just beating the crap out of the other player fans.
A RO on the bench should reduce the other player FF by 1

Khrage · Post by **Khrage** » Mon Oct 28, 2002 10:42 pm

Hmm, must be your leagues rules then. LRB states it pretty clearly on page 26. But leagues differ...thank God.

Matsu · Post by **Matsu** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 2:12 am

Obviously it's dangerous if you allow your opponent to control the field and surround your Rat Ogre. That being said, it's not too tough to keep him fairly safe from getting caged up.

When you're kicking off, don't put him on the LOS - put him behind your LOS and use him as a blitzer (you have to admit his stats make him one of the very best blitzers in the game). Since he's back off the line, your opponent won't be able to set up a cage of players around the RO since they only get 1 blitz.

When you're the receiving team, it's even better since you can put him on the LOS in a setup of your choosing and use him to start bashing open the hole for your gutterrunners to scamper through.

One last thought - LEADER. Get a leader and save his reroll to recover from the inevitable Rat Ogre turnover. Some folks say to use 'pro', but I don't think it's reliable enough.

-Matsu

Kamikaze Rudy · Post by **Kamikaze Rudy** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 7:41 pm

_____L_L_L_____
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_S_____L_____S_
____G____G_____
_______R_______
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My Rat Ogre has been my main blitzer since game one also. I take care to not let him get hit that often. And with Block, Pro now it doesn't really matter if he gets himself into trouble. His upside far outweighs his downside. He had his second skill by his third game. I always employ him as a safety on defense, and as soon as my opponent runs a catcher into my backfield, he knows that the Rat Ogre will hit him. Next skill on Doubles is Tentacles. I will never let another catcher escape his grasp again.

As far as a starting lineup goes...I just bought my first Thrower after nine games. I have no use for the skaven thrower. He's good as far as throwers go, but he's a liabilty to pick up the ball, even with surehands. Give me a Gutter Runner to toss the ball around anyday. It's a damn shame that the Chaos team killed my Sure Hands, Pass Gutter Runner.

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 8:09 pm

I don't know what you're thinking, here. I always make a point of starting a Skaven team with two Throwers, as Sure Hands and Pass are invaluable skills for any team. Give them block and they're excellent defenders. Give them Accurate and they are as good as throwing with your Gutter Runner. Give them Safe Throw and your next GR doubles has to be Nerves of Steel. I can only imagine your gutter runners are the main focus of your opponent, since they double as scoring threats and throwers.

Matsu · Post by **Matsu** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 8:15 pm

The problem with using a Gutter runner to hold the ball instead of a thrower is that it's too easy for a single blitzer to get into your backfield and strip the ball from you because of the GR's low strength.

That being said, it's easier to get sure hands for your GR than the +1 AGI for your thrower. Of course, you can't get accurate/strongarm for a GR, either. It really just depends on whether you prefer a running strategy or a throwing strategy.

Matsu

Kamikaze Rudy · Post by **Kamikaze Rudy** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 8:24 pm

In all the seasons I've ever run with Skaven, the thrower has always been a liability. I've failed more times at picking up the ball with them than I care to count. They always seem to fail throwing the ball as well. I've always hated them. So, I just cut out the middle man. I use the GR's to run the ball effectively.

IMO, the Skaven aren't a great offensive team anyways, They do excel on defense though. And that's how I play them.

Kamikaze Rudy · Post by **Kamikaze Rudy** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 8:31 pm

oops..Double Post

Skummy · Post by **Skummy** » Thu Jan 16, 2003 8:45 pm

Wow. I could not disagree more - the Skaven have an incredibly good offence - second only to High Elves or Woodies. I'm averaging 2.6 TD's a game in 26 contests. Their defence is good, but their real weakness is armor. What kind of skills are your gutter runners taking for you to have trouble with scoring?

Kamikaze Rudy · Post by **Kamikaze Rudy** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 12:24 am

Well Skummy,

That's why I like using the Rats. I think that out of all the teams available, the Skaven can be the most flexible. It's not that I cannot score with them, I just prefer to play a defensive game with them. If the ball is on the ground, it belongs to me.

Darkson · Post by **Darkson** » Fri Jan 17, 2003 12:36 am

Apart from praying heavily to Nuffle

, any tips for playing a team with 2 RO's

in the REBBL Skaven league?