LRB 5 Guide to Starting Skills for All Teams

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:59 pm

To weigh in on the current debates, I think:

a) DDogwood's right that Rotters shouldn't bother with stats (except ST);

b) Fen is mostly right about MB vs. Claw: always take MB first unless you're only really concerned about Orcs or Dwarfs, or you really need a BG hunter now; and

c) Strong Arm with AG4 is a good selection if you have or know you can get Sure Hands, Pass and Accurate and it's not your first improvement. For most Throwers, two of the above 4 are included on the profile and the other two are early picks, so some guys should go Strong Arm on roll 2 (if you know 3 rolls are possible), and many should go for it on roll 3. Elves can up-prioritize it a touch, as they don't need doubles to get Dodge and can't usually use the Accurate bonus on QPs.

d) I take Leader and SH on my Elf Throwers because it lets me spend more starting money on cool Pro Elf positionals and less on boring re-rolls, and lets me go out and buy a cheap Apo fast instead of saving 100k for a RR or Catcher. I agree it's nice to build a bomber, but it's not as useful as you'd think: when you need a long play you've usually got an alternative, and an out-of-the-box Elf Thrower can chuck a Long Pass with 75% accuracy. Besides, the best odds in the world on the pass don't matter if the pick-up fails, and pick-ups are frequently made at TZ penalties anyway, maximizing the value of a RR. SH player gets Accurate, then Dodge (Strong Arm on doubles, except on roll #1). Leader gets Dodge, then Block (ignoring doubles). Leader might take +AV on 10, but SH (or rookie) would go for MA every time.

zephard · Post by **zephard** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 8:43 pm

Dark Elf:
Assassins: First Double is always Multiple Block, not Guard. Missing Multi-Stab is insane.

fen · Post by **fen** » Thu Apr 10, 2008 10:42 pm

DDogwood wrote:
I wouldn't take +AV or +MA on a Rotter, they die too easily and the increases aren't worth the TV.
Just think about that for a moment would you? Seriously, read it and think again.
I think it's possible to have different opinions without being rude about it.

No, I don't see a need to be polite about it when you're trying to put forward a standard suggestion guide and then fill it with non-standard suggestions for Chaos and Nurgle.

I'm tired of tippy-toing around people when they hand out bad advice to coaches who are just getting used to the game.

On a 6+4 you normally take either +MA or +AV for a Rotter (the only exception is if your team needs a specific skill like kick or DP). +AV essentially makes them the least hit target on your team, which increases their survival rate by loads. +MA is good because Nurgle are one of the slowest teams in the game (only Dwarfs and Khemri are slower iirc) and you lose when you get caught without a man who can move to the right position. With a single +MA that's potentially a whole extra 20 squares your team can cover.

It doesn't matter that these guys take double injuries when CAS'd, they're no more likely to get CAS'd in the first place than any other lineman. In fact they tend to last longer than the average Wood Elf or Skaven anyway as the smart coaches don't target them, they hit the pestigors. If you have Rotters that are better, that means there is less pressure on the 'gors to do all the work and less agression going their way.

Der_Doodle · Post by **Der_Doodle** » Sat May 17, 2008 1:01 pm

Just asking if it would be possible to sticky this thread instead of the old 4.0 one?

I mean would make it alot easier if I dont have to search this skill on a later page each time or click through the "old" thread to get to the link on the last page to find it

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Sat May 17, 2008 2:11 pm

The older threads had more consensus I think.
Not sure this deserves to be stickied in it's current shape.

Der_Doodle · Post by **Der_Doodle** » Sat May 17, 2008 2:36 pm

Well then maybe the older thread doesnt deserve a sticky anymore either

Atleast it is clearly a 4.0 only thread guide.
Or at the veryleast please change the name of the stickied threat that it contains 4.0 in it

to avoid newer TBB users confusion

PubBowler · Post by **PubBowler** » Sat May 17, 2008 3:23 pm

I'm sure a Mod will take a look at your request.

zephard · Post by **zephard** » Mon May 19, 2008 7:40 pm

PubBowler wrote:The older threads had more consensus I think.
Not sure this deserves to be stickied in it's current shape.

I have to agree, in that both the Dark elves and the High Elves, I am not in agreement.

I just took another pass over the Dark Elves and there is no way I am putting my voice in to give Guard to the Runners on a double, Strong Arm manybe, otherwise ignore it.

ClayInfinity · Post by **ClayInfinity** » Wed May 21, 2008 5:41 am

Will this thread be in shape? Will people agree?

No!

And that's the great thing about LRB5 with so many factors to be considered, it is harder to have the "standard" way a team should be built.

With TV impacted by skill selection and skill selection impacted by likely opponents, you can never put forward any suggestion without there being some sort of counter view.

And that is why I think LRB5 is great!

Example, I have had a great success with a Pro-Elf team with alot of wrestle on the line elves. Is this sensible? Who knows, but it worked for me, but may not suit certain players / leagues.

Der_Doodle · Post by **Der_Doodle** » Wed May 21, 2008 8:01 am

Well maybe then not a Pick this then this then this Skill list.

But it would be great if we can manage a list with those skills counted as most usefull.
I dont see any problem if it would be a slightly larger list with instead of 3 normal and 1 double skill like in the 4.0 threat a list of possible picks with 6-8 normal and 2-4 double skills. Its just that newbs (like me maybe) have something to choose from that has been approved and not waste their first skills on something where the majority thinks its totally useles..

just ny idea.

Or still at the very least mark the old thread that it is a 4.0 thread. A good couple of skills listed for doubles are normal skills already. But even 4.0 isnt a 100% perfect listing as Big Guys still had general access when that thread was written

Lizardmen

Krox
Normal: Block, Pro, Break Tackle
Double: Leader, Stand Firm.

Craigtw · Post by **Craigtw** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 11:28 pm

DDogwood wrote:Necromantic:
Zombies: Block, Tackle, Guard or Fend, Wrestle
Ghouls: Block, Side Step, Mighty Blow
Wights: Guard, Tackle, Dodge
Flesh Golems: Block, Guard, Dodge
Werewolves: Block, Dodge, Mighty Blow
Necromantic teams should take all stat increases, except Zombies may find skills more valuable than +AG

I find it surprising that nobody suggested any ball handling skills. I thought Sure Hands would be a good choice for one of the ghouls especially seeing as the team has such expensive rerolls!

s031720 · Post by **s031720** » Sat Nov 22, 2008 4:35 pm

Dark Elf:
Linemen: Block, Dodge
2nd: Guard
+1 kicker
Fend and Wrestle for variety.

Runners:
Throwertype: Sure Hands, Pass, Kick-off Return 2nd: Strong Arm
Recievertype: Diving Catch or NoS, Leap 2nd: Possibly Juggernaut or Grab.
Blend and mix with Block, Dodge, Guard for variety.

Assassins: Block, Jump Up, Dodge, Sidestep
2nd: Multiple Block,

Blitzers: Dodge, Sidestep
2nd: Guard
Tackle, Strip Ball, Dauntless, Shadowing for variety
+1 player with sure hands.

Witch Elves: Block, Sidestep
2nd: Grab or Juggernaut

Statincreases; Most, but think twice before +MA on linemen.[/u]

Decker_cky · Post by **Decker_cky** » Sat Nov 29, 2008 2:34 am

Chaos:
Beastmen: Block, Guard, Dodge
Chaos Warriors: Block, Claw, Dodge
Minotaurs: Claw, Juggernaut, Block
Chaos teams should take any stat increases, except +AG or +MA on the Minotaur

I don't think the chaos entry is very well done at all.

Beastmen need an extra arm player or two early. I think it's worth noting on this entry that they should be building role players moreso than other teams rather than building cookie cutter players. Leap is a strong doubles choice for beastmen (in fact, I consider it to be head and shoulders above other choices).

Warriors should have block/guard/mighty blow as standard. Claw is a niche skill that should never be taken before MB.

Minotaurs key normal skills are claw, tentacles and juggernaut. Tents needs to be in there.

s031720 · Post by **s031720** » Wed Dec 03, 2008 7:55 am

Decker:
I agree that MB is better than Claw in most leagues.
Also agree that Tentacles is goodfor Mino, right after block. Must have block on a frenzier. Instead of tentacles on the mino you could go with diving tackle on one or two of your beasties, will save up skillroom but require more on-pitch-micro-skills.

I believe dauntless should be considered for beastmen, esp so since the horn-bonus are added afterwards.

Leap is an interesting skill for beastmen, never thought to take it, but should be a great cagebreaker with horns. Complement with block asap.

Consider making a warrior your prime scorer. A blodge ST4 isnt easy to take down.

Pro is always good for big guys. Claw is nice on mino aswell, esp considering that with horns you can 2d blitz any opps. big guy except for treemen. Even a stunned op. big guy can make quite a diffrence.

Grumbledook · Post by **Grumbledook** » Wed Dec 03, 2008 9:12 am

s031720 wrote:I believe dauntless should be considered for beastmen, esp so since the horn-bonus are added afterwards.

read the dauntless description again, dauntless roll takes place after adding modifiers (excluding assists), so horns gets added before the roll

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LRB 5 Guide to Starting Skills for All Teams

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