Vampires

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:38 pm

My complaint with the official roster is that as it is it doesn't feel like a vampire team to me because so few vamps can make it onto the pitch at one time, unless you want them to destroy your own team.

So to increase the number of vampires on the field I'm thinking of dropping OFAB and dropping their strength down to 3 while leaving everything else the same.

But just to make sure I'm not viewing this with blinders on I was wanting to get some feedback. Is the possibility of 6 hypnotic gazers on the pitch at once too much? Am I inadvertantly overpowering them?

Thanks.

Xtreme · Post by **Xtreme** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:56 pm

Give Hypno gaze to the highelf linemen and you should find out if its broken. I think you may find it to be a problem.

As far as it not feeling like a vampire team because of the lack of vampires, i've always enjoyed the Vampire stories that showed them as solitary figures with a bunch of hangers-on. So the team seems perfect to me.

wesleytj · Post by **wesleytj** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 5:58 pm

Vamps with the ST of ordinary humans isn't fun either though, even if it is a decent idea balance-wise. It doesn't fit their flavor or their lore at all.

I think the current version is the best Vamp team we've had so far, in terms of both balance and fluff. Perfect? No. But I like it a lot more than your proposal.

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:12 pm

wesleytj wrote:Vamps with the ST of ordinary humans isn't fun either though, even if it is a decent idea balance-wise. It doesn't fit their flavor or their lore at all.

I think the current version is the best Vamp team we've had so far, in terms of both balance and fluff. Perfect? No. But I like it a lot more than your proposal.

I don't mind the loss of the ST that much. For me the agile/HG/regen plus GSA access makes them vampires to me. Though Xtreme might be reinforcing my thoughts that 6 HG on the pitch might be too much.

But then again that's the joy of house rules. You can make up whatever you want, try it out, change it again until you get the feel you and your gaming group are looking for.

fen · Post by **fen** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 6:25 pm

Highlander wrote:I don't mind the loss of the ST that much. For me the agile/HG/regen plus GSA access makes them vampires to me. Though Xtreme might be reinforcing my thoughts that 6 HG on the pitch might be too much.

Agreed on this here. But they would need cutting down to 0-4 then and maybe a vampire counts themed positional added in to make up for the loss, nothing fancy - a pair of ghouls for example.

0-4 6348 Hypno Gaze, Regen
0-2 7337 Dodge
0-16 6337 None
70K rerolls
Doesn't seem like a major power team to me. Could always substitute Wights if something slower is needed.

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:07 pm

fen wrote: Agreed on this here. But they would need cutting down to 0-4 then and maybe a vampire counts themed positional added in to make up for the loss, nothing fancy - a pair of ghouls for example.

0-4 6348 Hypno Gaze, Regen
0-2 7337 Dodge
0-16 6337 None
70K rerolls
Doesn't seem like a major power team to me. Could always substitute Wights if something slower is needed.

I do like this idea a bit more. It solves my issue of wanting to consistently have 4 vampires on the pitch while not over doing it on the Hypnotic Gaze. Plus the ghouls give it just something a bit more to make up for the loss of 2 vamps. Though I'm not a fan of the current ghoul models, so I'll need to find models I like or just switch the ghouls to runners. Thanks for the suggestion.

fen · Post by **fen** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:10 pm

Highlander wrote:Though I'm not a fan of the current ghoul models, so I'll need to find models I like or just switch the ghouls to runners. Thanks for the suggestion.

You mean the BB ghouls? Because the WFB/Heresy ones are perfect for the job and look less like Chubby McManBoobs and his pal Curly Fries.

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:25 pm

fen wrote: You mean the BB ghouls? Because the WFB/Heresy ones are perfect for the job and look less like Chubby McManBoobs and his pal Curly Fries.

Yep, those are the ones. Chubby and Curly are definitely not at the top of my list of favorite BB models.

fen · Post by **fen** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 8:55 pm

In which case you might like this offering from Heresy
http://www.heresyminiatures.com/images/db009_grey5.jpg
http://www.heresyminiatures.com/images/db009_grey1.jpg

http://www.heresyminiatures.com/deathball.htm

Also these convert easily from WHFB and are exactly the same style as the Heresy one.

Digger Goreman · Post by **Digger Goreman** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:32 pm

I never knew ghouls to have such big balls!

I like these best: http://www.miniature-giant.com/ghouls-a ... r-470.html

Snew · Post by **Snew** » Tue Jul 31, 2007 11:56 pm

APO can heal a Ghoul, before you ask.

Highlander · Post by **Highlander** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:27 am

Snew wrote:APO can heal a Ghoul, before you ask.

Hey, can an apothecary heal a gh...oh wait...

Buggrit · Post by **Buggrit** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 9:58 am

fen wrote: Also these convert easily from WHFB and are exactly the same style as the Heresy one.

All sculpted by Paul Muller... although if you don't want to buy from GW Heresy do other ghouls which convert with a simple weapon snip and the addition of some GS pads...

Bad picture of my ones (scanned the miniatures as I didn't have a digital camera worth a crap at the time)
Ghouls

mattgslater · Post by **mattgslater** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:49 pm

Blood Lust is broken. It's horribly, awfully, terribly broken. It doesn't need to be fixed, it needs to be replaced. Knocking ST to 3 is one way to keep the player affordable and the team balanced, but it doesn't seem Vampire-like; Vampires are supposed to be really really strong.

What about reducing the availability to 0-4 and jacking up the price instead? It sure would be simpler, and you could allow another 0-2 positional, as the team would suffer from affordability issues. If they had an anti-skill that wasn't so awful, that'd be great. We could just keep Loner; it really reduces the player's maximum utility, gives too-smart-for-their-own-good coaches a temptation to skimp on TRRs, and seems really fluffy for egomaniacal vampires who all hate each other and don't believe in practice or conditioning.

Here's my shot.
0-4 Vampire 6/4/4/8 Hypnotic Gaze, Loner, Regenerate 140k
0-16 Thralls (Hobbos)
0-2 Ghouls
70k RRs

100 pts
8 Thralls, 2 Ghouls, 2 Vamps, 3 RR, 1 Apo or 5 banked (if 0-2 Ghouls)
7 Thralls, 2 Ghouls, 3 Vamps, 2 RR, 2 FF/whatever
9 Thralls, 3 Vamps, 3 RR, 1 FF

At 110, just turn a Thrall to a Vamp and you're set. Or in a 110 tournament upgrade a Thrall to a Ghoul and hire an extra Ghoul off of the last list... that would be pretty cool, 13 players and 3 RR, but it's certainly not broken. The Apothecary instead-of-Regen rules would also "feel" right on this team, as the guys who can't use the Apothecary also can't use TRRs, but with the Ghouls and suddenly-worth-investing-in Thralls, both Apo and TRRs will be useful. These guys would start off with some real holes but also a real chance to win, and would develop into a solid team over many many games (kind of like Chaos). If they balance out to Chaos, that's a good thing: the game doesn't need another 1st-tier team, but teams that can't win aren't fun either.

fen · Post by **fen** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 3:22 pm

mattgslater wrote:Here's my shot.
0-4 Vampire 6/4/4/8 Hypnotic Gaze, Loner, Regenerate 140k
0-16 Thralls (Hobbos)
0-2 Ghouls
70k RRs

Best Team in the Game.