Tournament competition suggestions

[Indigo]

Going along with the promising theory that rather than go for a single EB style team tourney and an individual tournament that may or may not be as interesting, we go with multiple TEAM tournaments and an individual event for those who want to play NAF games with a range of different races etc.

Here is an initial list of possible competitions:

8 player, EuroBowl style tournament
This will follow a near identical format to the existing EuroBowl in that 8 player unique-race national teams are submitted. Team members are chosen according to each nation's tradition. Points are scored on a W/D/L - 1/0.5/0 basis with the nation having the most points winning after round 9.

4 player "Foursomes" tournament
Each nation submits a team of 4 people. Rules here can either be race choices must be unique, or races can be duplicated - need to discuss the merits of each. Do we want all tournaments to use EB rules or is variety important? What scoring system should be used in a foursome tournament - should it be similar to golf in that the overall W/D/L scored by a nation are added together and if it beats their opponent for that round they get a point. If scores are level, points are halved. If they lose, nil point.

Doubles tournament
Coaches pair up (by nation? Independent of nation?) - what scoring system to use?

Individual tournament
To make it unique, why not allow coaches to use different races in different round to get NAF rankings with more than one race? What about a swiss format but also with a "challenge" element so coaches lower down can challenge higher coaches that they would otherwise not get to play (therefore not get the chance to compete with?)

Painting competition
I *definitely* think we need to run a large, structured painting competition in the style of Golden Daemon. Categories would be rated Gold/Silver/Bronze with an overall "Best of tournament" award.

Best Team
Best Big Guy
Best Star Player
Best Diorama
Duel (like the GW one, two models only on a medium sized base)
Best Dugout
Best Stadium
Players Choice

Perhaps also with seperate Best GW, Best Independent awards too? If GW allows it on their turf...

I think we'd need to pick dedicated judges for most but also have everyone vote on their favourite gold rated entry for the Player's Choice award.

I will use this thread to track suggestions and agreements as we go along. Thoughts?

[Emberbreeze]

8 player, EuroBowl style tournament

I think if you want national team spirit and a 'football' world cup feel then this is the preferred option. It does leave many people out though

4 player "Foursomes" tournament

Makes it more of a team event with teams being formed as national, club, religion (NBA ) etc. Sounds good but wont have the same atmosphere and you will only be cheering for your own team.

Doubles tournament

Sounds a bit gimmicky?

Individual tournament

Variation on a normal tournament but will people actually swap teams, do you enforce using a minimum number of teams? I imagine the top players will use the same team all the time and it wont make much difference.

I agree with the painting competition being as big and wide ranging as possible. with prizes worth travelling for even if you don't play.

I think that the main event should be the largest individual tournament ever over 6 games, with the team tournament running around the main event and lots of other fun games (Dungeonbowl), painting sessions, tournaments (doubles, BB7s, Beachbowl, Streetbowl etc) going on for those not involved in the team event. People can pick and choose what they do, or just watch the team event.

[Indigo]

Adding another?

Stunty Cup
Open to Goblin, Halfling and Ogre teams only. Inducements allowed. Probably not done on a national basis, more to find out who is the champion of the miniature heroes

[Indigo]

Just to clarify, I'm proposing these tournaments run alongside each other. So if you don't want to/can't play for the 8 man squad then there will certainly be another tournament there for you to prove yourself in.

[Pipey]

Is the idea here that the results of each of the individual tournaments all go together to decide which nation is champion of the world?

Or is the 8 player race-unique contest the only which would decide the WC winners?

If the 8 player contest is seen by everyone as the main event with the others much less significant, then it may be difficult to recruit people to play in the other events.

[Indigo]

I was hoping to edge away from the concept of one "be all and end all" EuroBowl-esque tournament being the only thing worth attending and propose a number of different, equally worthy events that people can participate in.

If people think that the 8 player team event is the only thing worth doing then to me at least it's a sign that they aren't getting the point of doing this. Sure, a team event is important but so are all the other events that could be held over the weekend.

[Longshot]

you have 3 options:
-Give an WC award to each different tournies/painting competition.
-Give one Total World Cup with allowing a system of point for each tournament and contest, Country with the more of it, Wins the World Cup

-Doing Both:
-giving a price for each tournament and prices.
wich also can be valuated in averall points...
And the trophee will go the the country with the most total points

This make everybody be a part of the Team. Even if we know some country will be surely more represented. But at least there is also awards for each competition. So can be good for almost everyone.

[Indigo]

Great idea.

[Xtreme]

IMO this is the most promising path to follow, I really like the direction indigo is suggesting.

[Bevan]

To make it unique, why not allow coaches to use different races in different round to get NAF rankings with more than one race? What about a swiss format but also with a "challenge" element so coaches lower down can challenge higher coaches that they would otherwise not get to play (therefore not get the chance to compete with?)

This is a great idea for coaches with lots of different races, but as an individual event it would be a problem for coaches travelling who would need to take 6 or 8 races. However, if this was a team event, each coach would only need to take 1 or 2 races each, then they would share them around duirng the event. You probably couldn't force a team of 6 to only use 6 races between them, since they would never agree on which 6 races they could all play. Perhaps you could require that every coach has to play a different race every round, each coach in a team plays a different race from the other team members in each round, and every race gets played at least once during the event.

I suppose the last option, play every race once, could be covered by 7 coaches in 3 rounds.

[Longshot]

by the way... if you can includes finals in your Timetable... would be great if possible... or letting it open until the end ?

That's also a matter of taste. i prefer Final.

[Mordredd]

4 player "Foursomes" tournament
...Do we want all tournaments to use EB rules or is variety important?

I don't think that variety is a good idea here. They should all be the same for simplicity (although we don't need to stick to the established Eurobowl rules for the 8 team event).

Painting competition
I *definitely* think we need to run a large, structured painting competition in the style of Golden Daemon. Categories would be rated Gold/Silver/Bronze with an overall "Best of tournament" award.

Best Team
Best Big Guy
Best Star Player
Best Diorama
Duel (like the GW one, two models only on a medium sized base)
Best Dugout
Best Stadium
Players Choice

Perhaps also with seperate Best GW, Best Independent awards too? If GW allows it on their turf...

I think we'd need to pick dedicated judges for most but also have everyone vote on their favourite gold rated entry for the Player's Choice award.

I don't like the idea of separating GW and 'others' for awards. Keep it simple and just have the categories as listed. (Though I'm really not convinced over the stadium one. And what about a diorama?) Entrants can then mix and match and don't have to worry about eligibility 'issues'.

As for judges, well you could see if any of the Golden Daemon ones would do it. I'm sure they would do a good job and give the independents a fair viewing (if they wanted to get involved that is). Or perhaps some of the better 'eavy Metal painters (current or former), Slayer Sword winner or another well respected professional. But whoever you get needs to have a decent level of respect as either a painter or a judge for the painting prizes to really mean much. (Which leads me to express disquiet about the "coaches' choice" award which, IMO, is too easily/often about politics or "liking the idea" than it is about how well painted the models are.)

[Bevan]

The Painting section could include -

Best converted team, with emphasis on position players being easily recognizable, and variety of figures, more than the painting itself.

This could include conversions from Warhammer or other figures and also production of mutant Chaos or Skaven from existing BB models. (I have an entire team of Chaos mutants for LRB4, but the type of mutations are nearly all unsuitable for LRB5. )

[Indigo]

I don't think that variety is a good idea here. They should all be the same for simplicity (although we don't need to stick to the established Eurobowl rules for the 8 team event).

Fair enough. The thinking that I have now though is if we have 8 players from each country in the Team event and lots in the individual event, just how many leagues will we get sending delegations of four coaches? Probably a few from the UK, but not many from abroad I'd think. So might be best to drop this tournament now I think about it.

I don't like the idea of separating GW and 'others' for awards. Keep it simple and just have the categories as listed. (Though I'm really not convinced over the stadium one. And what about a diorama?) Entrants can then mix and match and don't have to worry about eligibility 'issues'.

OK fair point too. Diorama IS in there though Stadium one is important I think, because not only do a lot of overseas coaches put a lot of effort into them too. And I am doing one

As for judges, well you could see if any of the Golden Daemon ones would do it. I'm sure they would do a good job and give the independents a fair viewing (if they wanted to get involved that is). Or perhaps some of the better 'eavy Metal painters (current or former), Slayer Sword winner or another well respected professional. But whoever you get needs to have a decent level of respect as either a painter or a judge for the painting prizes to really mean much. (Which leads me to express disquiet about the "coaches' choice" award which, IMO, is too easily/often about politics or "liking the idea" than it is about how well painted the models are.)

My one thought against that would be they might not appreciate judging non-GW miniatures. There is also the prospect of them not recognizing independent miniatures and confusing them for conversions/scratch builds when they are in fact "stock" models. My initial idea was to use recognised painters on the BB scene but they are precisely the people who will want to enter. Tricky one but getting hold of Eavy metal guys etc. may well be the best way forward.

[Longshot]

Stadiums are difficult to bring from outside UK... But why not