Blood Bowl 40,000

[Darkson]

… you'd need to consider balance first, 40K fluff second.

Of course, but you still need to consider both (whatever the order). If you end up with a team of players which is perfectly balanced but who just don't <i>feel</i> like Space Marines, what was the point of the exercise?

Bingo.

[stormmaster1]

In 40k the marines are faster than humans in the fluff but not in the stats, so a movement of 6 would be ok, even a movement of 6. As such they could be either as chaos warriors or as M6 chaos warriors. With the fluff you'd expect the block skill, but that would just be too good. i wouldn't allow them ag access though. what about Terminators? that could be a big guy, and if you made the battle suits used prototypes then you'd have a reason for them to malfunction (bonehead)

[mlindsay2706]

Id say 0-2 terminators?

Something like mummys because of the power armour:

MA 4
ST 5
AG 1
AV 9

Because of power armor I'd give them extra movement but less ag, to represent that they can move, but not dodger or are particularly agile.

Mighty blow, block?

Just a thought. Based on the mummys, with less ag but more movement, no regen but block instead.

[kadu-c]

I've found the old rules created by French GW Mail Order... They were based on the 3rd edition.
As you will see, teams are not very balanced !
Some races are missing (Tau) or are incomplete (Necrons) because these rules were designed many years ago.

Imperial Team
0-12 Imperial Guard 40.000 6 3 3 7 (G)
0-6 Space Marine 100.000 5 4 3 9 Block (G S P)
0-4 Terminator 120.000 3 5 1 10 Block, Thick Skull (S)

RR 50.000

Orks
0-12 Boy 60.000 5 4 2 9 (G S)
0-4 Gretchin 40.000 6 2 3 7 Dodge, Stunty, Right Stuff (A)
0-4 Nob 120.000 5 5 2 9 Thick Skull (G S)

RR 60.000

Chaos
0-12 Adorator 40.000 6 3 3 7 (G M)
0-6 Space Marine 100.000 5 4 3 9 Block (G S P M)
0-4 Terminator 120.000 3 5 1 10 Block, Thick Skull (S M)

RR 70.000
Mutations on doubles.

Eldars
0-12 Guardian 70.000 6 3 4 8 (G A)
0-2 Banshee 110.000 7 3 4 8 Dodge, Hypno Gaze (G A)
0-2 Harlequin 110.000 7 3 4 7 Leap, Foul Appareance (G A P)
0-2 Wraith Guard 90.000 5 4 3 9 (S)

RR 50.000

Dark Eldars
0-12 Warrior 70.000 6 3 4 8 (G A)
0-4 Wych 110.000 7 3 4 7 Dodge, Block, Side Step (G A)
0-2 Grotesque 90.000 5 4 3 9 Frenzy, Foul Appearance (G)
0-2 Haemonculus 80.000 6 3 4 9 Dirty Player (G A)

RR 50.000

Tyranids ( )
0-12 Termagaunt 50.000 6 3 3 7 Extra Arms (G M)
0-6 Hormagaunt 100.000 8 3 4 8 Claws, Leap (G A M)
0-4 Genestealer 120.000 7 4 3 9 Claws, Razor Sharp Claws (G S M)
0-2 Tyranid Warrior 120.000 6 5 3 9 Extra Arms, Leader (G S M)

RR 70.000
No Apothecary
Mutations on doubles

Necrons
0-12 Necron Warrior 90.000 4 4 2 10 Regen (G S)
0-6 Scarab 40.000 8 2 3 10 Regen, Stunty (A)

RR 70.000

Sisters of Battle
0-12 Frateris militia 40.000 6 3 3 7 (G)
0-2 Preacher 60.000 6 3 3 7 Frenzy, Dauntless (G)
0-6 sister of Battle 70.000 6 3 3 9 Block (G)
0-4 Superior Sister 110.000 5 4 3 9 Block, Guard (G)

RR 50.000

[Joemanji]

Orks
0-12 Boy 60.000 5 4 2 9 (G S)

See, this is the problem I have with projects like this. Who, and I mean who, gives a Black Orc +1 MV and charges 20K less for him, as a lineman no less?!?!? And why? What is the reasoning behind this statline? Orcs are Strength 3 in 40K right?

Oh right ... I just remembered you said these rules were made up by GW Mail Order Trolls. That explains it.

[kadu-c]

Oh right ... I just remembered you said these rules were made up by GW Mail Order Trolls. That explains it.

Actually there are probably typos in these stats.
For instance, Grotesques had ST3 AG4 and Haemonculi ST4 AG3...
I've swapped their characteristics in the list.

[Arven]

Wow! A lot of replies since I wrote this. Mostly on the tough issue of the Space Marines.

My list was like this:
0-12 Linemarines 70,000 5 3 3 9 Block General
0-2 Throwers 80,000 5 3 3 9 Sure Hands, Pass General, Passing
0-4 Blitzers 100,000 7 3 3 9 Block General, Strength
0-2 Scouts 90,000 7 3 3 8 Catch, Nerves of Steel General, Agility
0-1 Terminator 120,000 3 5 2 10 Big Hand, Big Guy, Mighty Blow General, Strength

I have changed my mind on many things, and my list at the moment (although it is not with me, and I'll correct it tomorrow) goes a bit like this:

0-16 Linemarines (Scouts) 70,000 6 3 3 8 Block G
0-2 Throwers (Scouts) 80,000 6 3 3 8 Sure Hands, Pass GP
0-4 Blitzers (SM in Power Armour) 110,000 6 4 3 9 Off To War GS
0-2 Catchers (Scouts) 90,000 7 3 3 8 Catch, Nerves of Steel GA
0-1 Terminator 120,000 3 5 2 10 Big Hand, Bonehead, Big Guy, Mighty Blow GS
RR 60K
Off To War: Nega-Trait, basically gives them a Niggling Injury that can't be Apothecaried, to represent the fact that they might be needed on the battlefield, which is more important than even the highest-ranking BB match.

- Block on Scout Linemen is to represent them being stronger than Human Linemen.
- I'll do the costs properly in a bit.
- Blitzers are the proper Marines, so they have S4. No Block and AG3 is because their armour is very restrictive on the small battlefield that is the BB pitch.
- NOS on the scouts because they are strong & focused enough not to be hindered by opposing TZs.
- Big Hand on Termy to represent Power Fist (though turned off)
- Bonehead and Big Guy on Terminator - although they're not stupid/incompetent, they are in very bulky armour with restricted vision/movement, so playing BB is rather tricky and they will not always see where the ball is.
- AV10 because you won't get any tougher infantry.

The French List, I've seen before, and yes, it is awful! I shall from now on try to ignore it...

[Joemanji]

Are we not assuming that BB40K would be set in an alternative version of the 40K universe, in the same way that BB is set in an alternate version of the WFB world? The point being that, in this universe, there are far less wars and much more Blood Bowl.

[Pink Horror]

40k Blood Bowl would have to be more like Necromunda than the battlefield. No group of something like Imperial Guardsmen is going to be willing to face off a bunch of fanatical genetic monsters in full power armour. BB40k should be a chance to make fun of as many forms of sci-fi sport as you can. No soldiers on the field!

[mlindsay2706]

No group of something like Imperial Guardsmen is going to be willing to face off a bunch of fanatical genetic monsters in full power armour.

But then what group of ANYONE would be willing to face a team of something like disease ridden, pus-bloated nurgle players?

In BB we have all members of the WFB races playing BB, so like nazgit siad, in a 40k version, less war more BB, so why wouldnt you have Imperial Guardsmen facing off agianst fanatical monsters? after all, the fanatical monster's coach would have to afford them first lol

[stormmaster1]

the french lists look very bashy. I can't see much standing up to a few geanstealers.

[Arven]

Are we not assuming that BB40K would be set in an alternative version of the 40K universe, in the same way that BB is set in an alternate version of the WFB world? The point being that, in this universe, there are far less wars and much more Blood Bowl.

I think that we can safely assume that.

However, there is still war, and the Space Marines will still make it a priority over BB.

40k Blood Bowl would have to be more like Necromunda than the battlefield. No group of something like Imperial Guardsmen is going to be willing to face off a bunch of fanatical genetic monsters in full power armour. BB40k should be a chance to make fun of as many forms of sci-fi sport as you can. No soldiers on the field!

I also have a Necromunda.. /supplement/ in the works with a team for each of the Houses, and might do Scavvy, Ratskin lists too. I plan to write rules for BB played in the streets of the Underhive. (Not entirely Dungeonbowl... more like BB with a building or two restricting parts of the pitch)

[Joemanji]

I also have a Necromunda.. /supplement/ in the works with a team for each of the Houses, and might do Scavvy, Ratskin lists too. I plan to write rules for BB played in the streets of the Underhive. (Not entirely Dungeonbowl... more like BB with a building or two restricting parts of the pitch)

I did a huge rulebook for that about 10 years ago ... I'll see if I can find it.

[Arven]

Wow, it would be great if you could find it!

[Arven]

I'v had a go at balancing the SM team, mostly based on Scouts - only 2 Power armoured guys allowed, as well as a Termy.

Space Marine Team:
0-16 Linemarines (Scouts) 70,000 6 3 3 8 Block G
0-2 Throwers (Scouts) 80,000 6 3 3 8 Sure Hands, Pass GP
0-2 Blitzers (SM in Power Armour) 110,000 6 4 3 9 Off To War, Thick Skull GS
0-4 Catchers (Scouts) 90,000 7 3 3 8 Catch, Nerves of Steel GA
0-1 Terminator 110,000 3 5 2 10 Off To War, Big Guy, Mighty Blow, Thick Skull GS
RR 70k (?)
Off To War: Racial Characteristic. Before each game, roll a D6 for each player on your roster with Off To War. On the roll of a 1, they are unavailable for that match, because they have been called up for the important business of defending the Impreium! This roll can in no way be changed, re-rolled or otherwise affected.

How much should their RR be, though? I'm thinking low-ish because they would be good at working together, but not too low, because the SM might not have enough time to practice (think Off To War) and their armour is a bit bulky for BB... does 60k sound fair?
- Made it 70k because mlindsay gave me a good reason.
- Removed Big Hand from Termy and reduced cost to 110k