You MUST try to catch the ball

ScottTBBF · Post by **ScottTBBF** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 4:22 pm

I'm a little confused as to why the wording of catching bouncing balls and kickoffs has been changed... it used to be that you MAY try to catch bouncing/kickoff balls and now the wording says you MUST.

Does anyone know why this has been changed? To me it seems stupid... why would I want my black orc/ogre/minotaur etc to try and catch the ball if it scattered to him... also, it has the potential to really slow down the game... if the ball scatters to a player on the moving team that has already moved, then you can't DO anything with it...

Any insights from those 'in the know' would be appreciated.

neoliminal · Post by **neoliminal** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 4:25 pm

ScottTBBF wrote:I'm a little confused as to why the wording of catching bouncing balls and kickoffs has been changed... it used to be that you MAY try to catch bouncing/kickoff balls and now the wording says you MUST.

Does anyone know why this has been changed? To me it seems stupid... why would I want my black orc/ogre/minotaur etc to try and catch the ball if it scattered to him... also, it has the potential to really slow down the game... if the ball scatters to a player on the moving team that has already moved, then you can't DO anything with it...

Any insights from those 'in the know' would be appreciated.

It was the difference between Queen's English and US/Canadian English.

"May" in Queen's English is not the same and had the meaning of "Must". The change was to clearify this point.

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 4:25 pm

Basically, the name of the game is get the ball and go score with it.

Makes the rules very simple when I can say if there is ever a chance to get the ball you have to try. Cleans up a lot of rules messes ... including a tactic that did delay the game ... the old Dwarf/Halfling/Goblin run into the square with the ball and deliberately scatter it to get it to a better square.

Galak

longfang · Post by **longfang** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 4:26 pm

Because it's instinct to grab for the ball I guess. In the heat of the moment a player wouldn't be able to look at their coach for instructions, they would just lunge for the ball. Ag 2 or 5, all players in reality would have a go. Makes perfect sense.

ScottTBBF · Post by **ScottTBBF** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 4:29 pm

OK, I understand the rationale behind the clarification now.

But I still fail to see how this improves the game.

The tactic of running a player into the square to deliberately scatter it is perfectly legitimate, from my viewpoint. The randomness of the scatter means its just as likely to benefit the opponent as it is the player who tries it. Plus ir provides at least a CHANCE to free up the ball and get some scoring happening.

And if an already-moved player must try to catch the ball, the play STOPS, essentially... you can't hand it off as a free action anymore, so whoever catches it is stuck with it. This could really suck for a team that carefully sets up a blitz to take down the enemy ball carrier, only to have it scatter to a guy who was just there to assist and thereby prevents the team from having a chance to score.

Maybe it's just me, but I prefer Blood Bowl games with lots of action, lots of chances to score and so on...

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 5:10 pm

Yep, it's happened to me before. Last turn of the half, I used all my movement and gfi's to throw a Blitz, knocked the player down and ended up with the ball. Another player was within scoring range ready to pounce on the loose ball! TD prevented by rolling too highly!
I don't like the scenario where you could burn a re-roll or use Pro in order to deliberately FAIL a dice roll. Goes against the grain. I'd rather a rule that made picking it up attempts compulsory, whilst catching a bouncing/scattering ball optional. That'd prevent deliberate moving onto a stationary ball to scatter it and avoiding the slightly ludicrous situations that can occur (albeit very infrequently) under the current rules.
After all, different skills apply to picking it up and catching it (and the +1 pick up mod.), so why not a different rule?

ScottTBBF · Post by **ScottTBBF** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 5:14 pm

Deathwing wrote:I'd rather a rule that made picking it up attempts compulsory, whilst catching a bouncing/scattering ball optional. That'd prevent deliberate moving onto a stationary ball to scatter it and avoiding the slightly ludicrous situations that can occur (albeit very infrequently) under the current rules.
After all, different skills apply to picking it up and catching it (and the +1 pick up mod.), so why not a different rule?

Why the dislike for the 'kick the ball around' rule? I've heard lots of people call it 'cheesy' because it

1) essentially gives you the potential for a free chance to catch the ball with no risk of a turnover

and

2) Can rapidly degrade all the effort that you put into placing TZs on the downed ball

BUT

It's random (the scatter) and could just as easily scatter to your opponent. It also makes for more chances to score for teams of every type, which is a Good Thing(tm) in my book.

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 5:22 pm

longfang wrote:Because it's instinct to grab for the ball I guess. In the heat of the moment a player wouldn't be able to look at their coach for instructions, they would just lunge for the ball. Ag 2 or 5, all players in reality would have a go. Makes perfect sense.

Hmmm....defender goes to get under the ball...keeper shouts...KEEEPERRRRR!!!!...defender allow keeper to collect...

2 baseball or cricket outfielders running under a high ball...we were always taught to call...MIIINEE!!!..(never ever "Yours!").
And I know we've all seen funny clips of collisions on TV, but they're the exception rather than the rule.

So you just levelled a guy and the ball bounces towards you...your Star Blitzer yells....LEEEEEAVE IT!!!!..makes as much sense to me...

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 5:29 pm

ScottTBBF wrote:Why the dislike for the 'kick the ball around' rule? I've heard lots of people call it 'cheesy' because it

1) essentially gives you the potential for a free chance to catch the ball with no risk of a turnover

and

2) Can rapidly degrade all the effort that you put into placing TZs on the downed ball

BUT

It's random (the scatter) and could just as easily scatter to your opponent. It also makes for more chances to score for teams of every type, which is a Good Thing(tm) in my book.

That's a wholly different thing to the point I'm making. I'm not really pro or against really, I can see the thinking why it's been changed though. I can't however see the logic behind having to catch a ball! That's a random thing that can screw you up rather than a rule change to deliberately prevent a certain tactic.

ScottTBBF · Post by **ScottTBBF** » Fri Jun 14, 2002 5:47 pm

:nods:

OK, that makes sense.

longfang · Post by **longfang** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 1:50 pm

Hmmm, were talking about a full contact sport here, albiet a fantasy one, do you think that amongst the crunching tackles, snapping bones, screams of pain and cheers from the crowd that a player shouting "leave it" is going to be heard or even get his message through to an obviosly low IQ BloodBowl player, albiet a little lead fantasy one.

Post by **Thadrin** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 4:33 pm

As a player of the nearest Real life equivalent (excepting possible Australian complete-absence-of-any-discernable-rules Football).
I can answer that: NO. You get a chance to grab the ball, you do so. Same in Rugby.

longfang · Post by **longfang** » Sat Jun 15, 2002 4:54 pm

That's sorted that then!

Not "yours" but "mine"

ScottTBBF · Post by **ScottTBBF** » Sun Jun 16, 2002 5:29 pm

I don't really care much for 'realism' being used to make judgements about whether or not rules in the game of BLood Bowl make sense.

It's already a highly artificial environment that bears only a passing resemblance to football.

All that said, what I'm most interested in is the game-related reason why you'd have to catch a ball. As I stated earlier, this requirement has the potential to completely stop a drive in its tracks.

Which I think is a Bad Thing(tm).

Deathwing · Post by **Deathwing** » Sun Jun 16, 2002 5:40 pm

I've just noticed this is a TBBF house rule.

Talk Fantasy Football

You MUST try to catch the ball

You MUST try to catch the ball

Re: You MUST try to catch the ball