Looking for good Nurgle resources/advice

[sunnyside]

Alright, I'm starting up a Nurgle team and thought to myself "Hmm, I wonder if there's a thread on this over at TFF?"



Seriously though, good stuff. I was thinking beast/4NW/1P/5RO/2RR would be a good starting team, and this thread was reinforcing that so I went with it, it looks like I might be up against some pro elves first. (With 210k in inducements, I'm thinking re-roll, and maybe another re-roll in hopes that if I lose 4-1 I can at least put that one on a NW).

I'm not sure about the exact development path I want, but the silver lining of Nurgle's speed of aquiring skills is I've got quite a while to decide what I want to do for second skills, to say nothing of thirds skills on NWs.

I'm thinking SF on the beast (and will probably block too often with him until he gets it), block on the first couple warriors and pesties to skill, and wrestle on rotters, unless my opponents' APOs suck and I get some rotters on the bench, at which point Dirty Player.

However i have some questions on offense, I've played mostly Norse, and a smattering of Undead and Wood Elves, so nothing nearly this slow and clumsy.

Against AG teams with a one step back defense I beleive the general tactic is to have a cagish structure, and in front of it a wall of players that advance and mark up the elves, forcing them to conceed at least one step or risk nasty nasty beatings. With Norse I liked to swing a guy or two around behind them. Does that work for nurgle or do I want to keep my guys in general proximity to each other? Should I put NWs on the cage corners? I read about them being there, but it'd seem they'd be better suited for the "wall" as it'd be harder for AG teams to knock 'em back the way they should be able to with rotters or pesties.

What do you do to advance the ball against a team that matches you for strength, beats you for skills, and is faster to boot like Orcs? Eventually I think claw may be the equalizer there, but that's going to be a while coming.

[Dzerards]

I haven't been playing Nurgle that long I'll admit, but I'm failing to see the attraction of Wrestle on rotters. Don't get me wrong, I likes me Wrestle on my Slann, Skaven and Elf teams, but I don't see it on MA 5 rotters.

My normal Nurgle defence is a rolling wall of strength, Disturbing Presence, Foul Appearance, Tentacles and Tackle Zones. I just don't see the point of voluntarily removing your own tackle zones to allow the opposition to just walk through.

I'm I missing something?


@Sunnyside, I'd go extra training and a merc Pestigor with 210k inducements. The extra man comes in handy cause with the low speed you can start to seriously get out positioned and you need 11 men on the pitch to defend effectively. Also it allows you to foul those pro elf blitzers with a rotter if you get the chance near the end of the first half!

On offence against a stalling defence, I think you need the NW as part of the cage corners. Otherwise they get caught up blocking a linesman each turn away from all the action and the cage gets swamped (ST3 vs ST3). Use the merc pestigor to blitz one in the wall back and then you can move the Beast up to grab three elves in his tentacles!

You could also induce Whiparm instead of the reroll and merc. You still have an extra man and the sure hands is really needed on this team to get the ball into safety.

[Grumbledook]

wrestle removes the opposing tackle zones to make it easier for you to walk through...

[Dzerards]

wrestle removes the opposing tackle zones to make it easier for you to walk through...

Sure, for a fast team. But Nurgle can't capitalise on those holes to anywhere near the same effect on offence, and suffer more by having these holes on defence.

I mean I can see the usefulness of putting it on a Pestigor, but spamming it on Rotters?

Unless your making the assumption that all fast teams will have wrestle, and all slow teams will have block? i.e. the fast teams will make those holes any way regardless if you have block, but by switching to wrestle you get an edge against other slow teams.

I still don't know. I would be inclined to stick with block over all though.

[Grumbledook]

Unless your making the assumption that all fast teams will have wrestle, and all slow teams will have block? i.e. the fast teams will make those holes any way regardless if you have block, but by switching to wrestle you get an edge against other slow teams.

This

and it is easier to move a slow team into holes created by wrestle than to to and move around the defence where there are no holes

[Carnis]

Also a developed nurgle team only fields 2 rotters on average, maybe 3-4 max on 2nd half if you are down 2 pestigors/nws. The blockspam is fine for the core-9, but getting 2-3 Wrestle in the lineup lets you get away with 2-3 less tackle when facing blodgers. It's not the same, but has other utilities as well. Also, it's a very common job for rotters to be sacrificed for the greater good, nothing nicer than getting a big guy or a BOB down with that wrestle if you were facing a slower team.

For me the main point is still the fact that I struggle to find enough spots for tackle in the team, and wrestle is a cheap substitute for that (preserves the rotters life, too).

My first rotter is always the DP nonetheless.

[mattgslater]

Wow. It's September 9th, 12:28 my time. Carnis wrote a statement with which I fully agree.

Duly noted.

[Joemanji]

Smack talk from 'Slater!

[mattgslater]

Not smack at all. Just an acknowledgement that there are multiple schools in this game, and sometimes they converge.

[sunnyside]

Ok, lemmi see if I've got this right.

In order to advance against an elvish one step back type defense you still keep your NWs on the cage, because otherwise the elves could swarm the cage, and the NWs have trouble getting away from linemen that might tie them up.

So you advance behind a wave of S3 AV8 no block players. Now the elves often have s3 and av8 as well, and they'll have some block, maybe some dodge, and they don't need to cage they've got more assist options. Therefore one would expect the elves to continually knock back the players marking them, and pretty soon you'd be men down and it'd all be downhill from there.

The reason it works is the beast. He goes forward with some support from other players TZs to prevent assists and to baby sit him and marks up some guys. Now dodging away may not work, blocking would a risky defenders choice block, so you get to grind ahead, painfully slowly, and than hopefully after 8 turns you're within scoring range or the opponent lost a few guys and you waltz in.

That perhaps is why builds that start with the beast are better than pestie builds. Even with two more pesties instead of the beast and a rotter you're still too slow to maneuver around elves, and now you either have to make a soft cornered cage or you lack the muscle to advance the forward line.

[Carnis]

Ok, lemmi see if I've got this right.

In order to advance against an elvish one step back type defense you still keep your NWs on the cage, because otherwise the elves could swarm the cage, and the NWs have trouble getting away from linemen that might tie them up.

So you advance behind a wave of S3 AV8 no block players. Now the elves often have s3 and av8 as well, and they'll have some block, maybe some dodge, and they don't need to cage they've got more assist options. Therefore one would expect the elves to continually knock back the players marking them, and pretty soon you'd be men down and it'd all be downhill from there.

The reason it works is the beast. He goes forward with some support from other players TZs to prevent assists and to baby sit him and marks up some guys. Now dodging away may not work, blocking would a risky defenders choice block, so you get to grind ahead, painfully slowly, and than hopefully after 8 turns you're within scoring range or the opponent lost a few guys and you waltz in.

I dont use my NWs in the cage, they are too slow for that. Rather I use whatever is available, sometimes 1-2 NWs happen to be around as well. But usually my opponent dictates it as I usually take all advantageous blocks. But mostly my offence relies on going man up with MB/PO, and that seems to work most of the time anyway.

[Dzerards]

I suppose it also depends on your opponent. I've had some crazy aggressive elves play me lately and I've been painfully aware of the 2 NWs still punching the same 2 LOS guys by the halfway line while the cage was getting overrun halfway up the pitch. (It's even worse when it's a zombie they get stuck on). If you opponent is all about the stall game by all means free up some of those NWs from cage duty and get stuck in. The main thing is to keep them close to the action.

The Nurgle offence is just that sucky that you will usually need 7-8 turns to score. And I don't mean bash your way to the endzone in 4 and stall for another 4, at least not on a rookie Rotters team anyhow. And yeah the beast makes a big difference against elves. It allows you to hold them in place long enough for the rest of the team to get their blocks in. He's especially nasty near the sidelines where he can lock elves in place for all sorts of surfing opportunities the following turn!

[sunnyside]

Wait. An elf might have sidestep or something. But I doubt a zombie would.

What I'm saying is why can't you just keep hitting with the NWs to advance the cage roughly one square per turn? Nurgle doesn't seem like they've got what it takes to whip around defenders the way Norse does, at least not until your a couple bodies up on the field or it's the last turn or two scramble. And than I'd think you'd want the mobile rotters serving on the corners.

[Smeborg]

sunnyside - I endorse your starting roster.

The Nurgle cage advances in a slow and clumsy way. Accordingly, anything you can get is good for a cage corner. The Beast, and to a lesser extent the Warriors, are best at tying up opposing players, so Rotters and Pestigors are just as likely to form cage corners as their less svelte colleagues.

I prefer to give the Pestigors Wrestle (except for one ball carrier), and the Rotters Block. Once the full team is purchased, you will start most matches with just 2 Rotters on the field (this number will go up as positional players start to fill up the dugout). The Rotters are quiet player types, they like to lend assists, escort the ball carrier or the Beast, make simple blocks to free up positional players, and they are ball handlers in case of need, especially towards the end of a match or at the end of long drives (Pestigors are favourite targets). Block fits this role well. Pestigors, on the other hand, with both +1MA and Horns, are often the players of choice for blitzing ball carriers and receivers. Wrestle fits well with this role.

All the best and good luck.

[Dzerards]

What I'm saying is why can't you just keep hitting with the NWs to advance the cage roughly one square per turn?

Cause a half is only 8 turns long and the pitch is 13 squares from LOS to end zone, so one square a turn ain't going to cut it. You have to push on as hard as you can. I initially found that my biggest hitters started to get stripped off from the main thrust of the offence, suck hitting the same nobodys, and by the time I got into scoring range, I didn't have the strength to either push through or withstand the cage getting swarmed.

Plus I'm talking about that initial stage of the team, where there are no skills, few rerolls and heaps of rotters. So you're not going to have MB/PO or even any block, so your blocking isn't so much for causing casualties as much a clearing space to move into.

Like I said, it all depends on who you're playing, my NWs in the cage have never been short of people to hit cause my opponents are so aggressive. If your opponents are just standing off you by all means push them forward. Just always try to keep them where the action is.

And to why a Zombie is the most annoying is because of the TV difference. 110k for the Nurgle Warrior against 40k for the Z. With no block or MB you can easily spend 4 or 5 turns either just pushing him back, or knocking him over for him to just stand back up again. Never mind the 1 in 9 times blocking him causes a turnover.