gloryfigures on ebay

[AK_Dave]

Also as a miniature manufacturer ... recasters are a easy sore point.

I agree that recasting is terrible for the hobby, but far worse than simply recasting something for your own use is recasting and then reselling. Thats unpardonable.

But pirating a DVD? Go for it. Any time I want to watch a movie that I own legally on my PC, I've circumvented copy protection to do so. If I want to watch that movie on my iPod, I've circumvented copy protection to do so. If I want to listen to music that I legally own on a device that I legally own, I've circumvented copy protection to do so. Thus: I pirate CDs and DVDs regularly. For my own use. Without distributing and without intent to distribute. But it is still in violation of the letter of the law. Therefore, I'm a pirate.

I don't have a problem with someone doing a little greenstuff relief mold of some detail from one model to reproduce it on another. If I broke and lost the feather from the helmet of a 2ed Dark Elf, that is how I'd fix it. Technically thats recasting too. I do have a problem with someone taking one model, even a rare and OOP model, and punching out copies of it even if only for personal use. I definately have a problem with someone selling those recasts, especially if they get pawned off to ME. I'd be livid.

But I don't have a problem with DVD piracy. Just distribution.

[AK_Dave]

I've missed loads of things on ebay because I refuse to pay the ridiculous prices that things go for, and I've posted here about figs I'm after but with no response.

I too refuse eBay's overinflated prices. Sometimes a reasonable deal can be struck, and eBay is not the only place to find such a deal.

I've had great success with TBB in getting my 2ed mini needs filled. Right now I'm afraid to post another wishlist because my last ones have been filled 100% faster than I expected and the figures aren't all painted yet. Its more the "I don't have them painted yet" which holds me back, as that has become a personal rule of mine.

[landrover]

Definite recaster imho. The pictures he displayed of the quality of the minis showed too much flashing even for GW.

Consistently 'sources' OOP and LOOP minis. Presumably when he buys more lead.

[GalakStarscraper]

The problem with recasting of out of print figures and selling them destroys one of the legs of the chair on the miniature seller industry.

Its a 3 legged chair.

There are normally 3 customers for a store like Impact! or many others that post here. I'm not totally familiar with Darkson Designs on this so I'll just speak from my own company.

Leg 1: The Gamer: These are customers whose primary focus is to use the miniatures to play a game. They might own more than one version of a given team or race but its more for the change in feel than any other reason ... this is your customer looking for function.

Leg 2: The Painter: This is the customer who buys the figure because it will look cool when they paint it and this is one of their main focus points. I know for example Impact! has sold a lot of Beer Garden Beauties to folks that told me they just bought it to paint it.

Leg 3: The Collector: This customer is purchasing items to collect them. He purchases them soon to make sure they don't go out of stock before he has them in his collection. He is willing to pay a premium for figures advertised as limited edition.

====

Recasters destroy leg 3 and that is a lot worse than it sounds. For example ... many tournaments use Impact!'s tournament figure service which we sell the extras for as limited edition. If recasting is accepted ... than the how reason for folks to be willing to pay a decent price when Impact! sells the left overs as limited is destroyed. This means we cannot move the extras because folks just wait for the recasts to start showing up. If we cannot sell the extras ... than VERY quickly Impact! removes offering to assist with tournament figures as an option from our company.

====

I hope this helps explain that even recasting of out of print figures for sale is evil and illegal. I won't convince all of you because its too easy to hate GW right now. But it really is a crime and not one that anyone should just accept ... not for any reason.

Galak

[Darkson]

Illegal? Yes, as are many other things people who use this site are.

Evil? Sorry - no. Murder is evil. Rape is evil. Recasting is not.

[Magictobe]

Illegal? Yes, as are many other things people who use this site are.

Evil? Sorry - no. Murder is evil. Rape is evil. Recasting is not.

Selling a rolex watch on an african beach at 1/100e of the original price is not evil. Everybody who buys it knows it is no original.

Selling a rolex on an ebay auction (not saying that it is a fake one, so letting buyers assume it is a real one) that is evil.

This is how I feel about the recasts on ebay. If you state that you are selling recasts. You get perhaps in legal problems but you are not ripping of customers. I know you cannot state that on ebay, you would get in trouble. But not stating this is ripping of consumers.

[howlinggriffon]

I've yet to see a recaster advertise by saying "These are not originals" on their ebay auctions. A lot seem to try to hide them by spraying them in undercoat, in fact. I bought a goblin team off ebay once and the undercoat was still wet and sticky when the parcel arrived in the post.

I used to be a moderator on GW's old forums and, as part of the team, I used to inform Tim Hucklebery about any suspected recasters I spotted on auction sites so he could contact GW legal about them. Since the forums shut down, I've tried emailing details to the various people in GW that I know and there just doesn't seem to be any interest anymore. I even sent that goblin team to them as evidence along with the details of the auction. Two years later, the trader is still currently selling on ebay and I didn't even get any replacement models from GW for my efforts. So I can understand why people just buy what's available where they can as GW don't seem to be trying to resolve the issue by taking action against the recasters or producing the rare models the recasters are selling.

So - although I personally won't buy anything I suspect is a recast, I'm not going to condemn people for doing so. Not while they have little alternative.

[Glorian Underhill]

Well his current auctions are chaos squats, squat soldiers, and a complete mint set of dwarven heroes of the old.

So I think there is no way he can get these minis possible without recasting. Or he just stumbled over a hoard of archeotech.

So my two cents, recasting is illegal, but some of his minis remind me of my youth and there is almost no other way than to get these minis nowadays.

[cyagen]

My lawyer brain agrees 100% with Galak.

My economist brain however can't get over the fact that GW is leaving a BIG part of the market empty. I mean, think about it, would you rather buy Skaven 2ed or 3ed at the same price? The economist in me is sick and tired of having to buy poor quality GW miniatures to play BB.

Recasting from an economist POV is a sign of poor business sense from GW.

Again, I do not want to anger the fig maker out there, but just wanted to explain why I would consider buying illegal stuff

[GalakStarscraper]

Again, I do not want to anger the fig maker out there, but just wanted to explain why I would consider buying illegal stuff

I freely admit that GW has done much of this to themselves.

Just cannot support re-casters.

As long as if you guys hunt down and destroy anyone who does this to Impact! (or any other company that takes the time to post and answer questions here) ... all good.

Galak

[Darkson Designs]

No matter how you want to justify it, recasting is wrong and its breaking the law.

[kiwiandy]

If every one feeling this strongly about him report hiim on ebay and if sets up as a different name report him again!!!

[kiwiandy]

i dont like re casting it devaules the collecter items

but gw has missed a treat on the 5th edition (latest edtion) of figurers

[traveller]

when i remember, what i paid for 2.ed Chaos minis like Wipearm, Sureclaw, Hammerslash and all the old heavy metall minis at ebay auctions some years when i started my collection! This was also before GW realised, that they still own some old moulds and started "recasting" and selling some 2.ed minis online again!
BTW i´m not sure if it is still possible at US or UKonline ?

I´m mostly the "Leg 3 Collector" and so recasts are a big NONONO for myself. As far i know i dont own recasted BB minis, but i got some recasted Squats once at a US ebay auction .

Well, i understand that the "Leg 2 player" dont want to pay the collector price for playing 2.ed OOP minis, but he still has the chance to play using p.e. the "cheaper" 3.ed GWminis

many tournaments use Impact!'s tournament figure service which we sell the extras for as limited edition

Yes,true, Galak, if those were no LE minis mostly i would´nt buy them.

Traveller

[Khambian]

And to think I almost bid on one of this guy's auctions recently...thanks for the wakeup call, folks.

The only potential warning signs of recasting I can think of (without figs in hand) are:
1) "Too good to be true" auctions, like this guy's 5 Elven Cheerleader lot.
2) As mentioned before, repeated sales of the same rare figures over and over again. The idea of legit stocks of 20+ year old minis is almost an oxymoron.

Tempting as it is sometimes, I don't think buying recasts is right. It's just a shame that G-Dub's archive service is borderline non-existent right now- that would leave no excuses.