Interception skill

[Colin]

With some of the discussions lately focusing on how to change or eliminate some of the skills/trailts/mutations that benifit the bashing teams (MB, RSC, PO,etc) I think that there should be some attention payed to balancing things out so that the agility teams don't get too powerful. (Yes, I know, the AG teams get beaten up by the ST teams, but by the time the ST team has whittled down the AG team so that they have a chance of scoring, it's in the second half with the AG team up3-0). Anyway, whether you agree with this or not, it is a fact that interceptions are too rare and there should be something done to increase the chance of one happening in a game. In one league I ran (the only one that I have all the team roster sheets) there were only 4 interceptions in 98 games played, and this was four different players all on different teams in four different games.
Anyway, not to belabour the point, I think that a new interception skill should be created. It would be an AG skill that gave the player a +1 on interceptions. Alternatively, if creating a new skill does not appeal to you (though interception skill isn't really new, there was one in the 2nd ed.), there could be changes made to leap skill and VLL. Each of these could gain the +1 to interception roll as well as what they do now. Lastly, if creating or modifying skills does not appeal to you, what about giving all players eligable to make the interception a roll (instead of just one of them). Start with the one nearest the passer and continue on down the line until either the ball is intercepted or all eligable players had a roll. By the way, this would be a regular intercept roll as it is in the rules now(just more chances).
What do you think?

[Thadrin]

If you were going to put in the whole "Any one can attempt an interception" then you should also limit the areas where an intercept can take place: within three squares of the thrower or the catcher would seem acceptable (after all, doesn't picking off a Long Bomb under the apex of its flight seem stupid? most interceptions are due to tipped balls or very close to the intended reciever.

And there's something else we never see: passes being knocked away.
I'd like to see the rule changed to something like a standard Ag roll with a -1 penalty, and then a roll on this table:
D6:
1-2 the ball is tipped, but still gets to the reciever. An extra -1 modifier is applied to the catch roll.
3-4 the ball is batted out of the air, and scatters three times from the would be interceptor.
5-6 the Interception is made!

I'd be fine with an "Intercept" skill - but it should be a general skill otherwise it remains the province of elves and skaven, whereas I think pass defence is more widely taught than actual catching (as a defensive coordinator myself I know it is). This would then replace the ability of the Catch skill to reroll Interceptions, and make them more common. The Safe Throw skill could use lightning up as well. Its too damned good, and would become more so if this tweak was introduced and interceptions/bats became more common.


These are ideas dragged off the top of my head, but it adds an aspect that is missing from the game, and could add a bit more chaos!

[Ghost of Pariah]

I like it! I really do! Hmmn. I'm behind you on this all the way! I don't think anyone on the BBRC will bond with it but I'll help you anyway I can! lol

[gallowin]

...it is a fact that interceptions are too rare and there should be something done to increase the chance of one happening in a game. In one league I ran (the only one that I have all the team roster sheets) there were only 4 interceptions in 98 games played, and this was four different players all on different teams in four different games.

what about giving all players eligable to make the interception a roll (instead of just one of them). Start with the one nearest the passer and continue on down the line until either the ball is intercepted or all eligable players had a roll. By the way, this would be a regular intercept roll as it is in the rules now(just more chances).
What do you think?

IMO interceptions are a rarity because most coaches don't throw long enough passes or play too conservative and there are less oppurtunities to intercept. Last season I only tried one throw with someone set up to intercept and wouldn't ya know the AG 2 Black Orc rolled a 6!

However I do like some of the ideas posted here. All players in the path can intercept, intercept added to the general skill list (+2 to intercept), etc. I'm not sure about the batting down rules. Maybe if you miss the intercept by 1 the pass scatters 3 times from that square... Pass Block as it stands now is already built to allow you to cause negative modifiers by being in passer/catcher TZ and that seems good enough.

Question: do you allow intercepts for players standing in a square in front of the passer (with a -1 TZ mod of course)?

[wesleytj]

I'm OK with a new "interception" skill, but to be honest I don't think interceptions are too rare. Sure they don't happen very often, but they shouldn't because it's almost a guaranteed win when you do!

I for one have never lost in game in which I got an INT. It's such a huge turnaround, and often you can score that same turn...in essence it's a 2 score swing (take one from them and give it to you)

This is particularly true in the post-card era, where opportunities to create turnovers are less rampant.

[Colin]

I'm OK with a new "interception" skill, but to be honest I don't think interceptions are too rare. Sure they don't happen very often, but they shouldn't because it's almost a guaranteed win when you do! :

This also seems to be the opinion of the people at Fanatic. I e-mailed Andy Hall about the interception skill idea, but he replied that picks were meant to be rare because they have a huge effect on the game, so I don't expect the skill to be adopted officially. I just wanted to see what regular BB players thought. I really like Thadrin's suggestions.

[Thadrin]

Bear in mind one thing: my idea would result in FEWER interceptions, but many more scrambles for the ball. I think it could add an extra level of thinking: "do I take the cahance that that guy can knock the ball down, or do I risk the Dodge so I can throw around him?"
"egads! he's knocked the pass down! do I have a guy free who can get to the ball quick?"

I'd certainly like to test it.

[wesleytj]

Wow somebody in a position of BB authority actually agreed with a notion I held about the game?!?!?

I thought I was forever doomed to be the Cassandra of Blood Bowl.

[Marcus]

I'm a little confused what you have against the skill Pass Block.

Yes it's difficult to pick off a pass with an AG 2 or 3 player but it's quite easy to get your players into a position where you are within 3 squares of a thrower or catcher so they can charge down the pass and force a fumble.

Factor in skills like Foul Appearance, Shadowing (nice one with passblock or FA) and Very Long Legs and you have a number of ways to shut down the pass plays of a Finesse team.

There's a great deal more to playing Power vs Finesse than the casualty count. You don't need to change the rules in order to shut down Elves, you just need to reassess how you're stopping their plays.

Besides which, I'm of the opinion that Finesse teams took an utter pasting ever since the handoff rule changed. I think that one rule changed drastically tipped the balance back from Finesse teams and I'm not convinced any further "balancing" is required.

Marcus

[Acerak]

Change Safe Throw so that it works only on a roll of 4+ and make the INT modifier -1 instead of -2. Voila! More interceptions if that's what your league wants.

-Chet

[fe2mike]

Change Safe Throw so that it works only on a roll of 4+ and make the INT modifier -1 instead of -2. Voila! More interceptions if that's what your league wants.

-Chet

I love the idea, simple and effective!

[wesleytj]

Change Safe Throw so that it works only on a roll of 4+ and make the INT modifier -1 instead of -2. Voila! More interceptions if that's what your league wants.

-Chet

Only problem is that what that means is that NOBODY will take Safe throw anymore. I always kinda got picked on for taking it because it didn't come into effect very often, but I liked it because (as I noted earlier in this thread) 1)interceptions have a MAJOR effect on the outcome of a game, and 2)because this almost completely eliminated the possibility.
I was about the only person who ever took it in my league.

I wouldn't take the new version you're suggesting...unless I got a thrower to like 6 or 7 skills and didn't roll any doubles or upgrades. So who would that leave?

[Marcus]

I rather like Safe Throw on AG3 teams like Humans or Skaven. It allows you to create a deadeye thrower who can make a pass over the LoS to the #1 reciever. Elves can usually execute a Give and Go since they don't have to worry as much about making the extra handoff.

Marcus

[Kri]

You take Safe Throw so you don´t have to care where your opponents´ players are.

And I have a Lion Warrior with AG5, Pass Block, NofS and Catch.
Trust me, you REALLY want Safe Throw if he´s around because he´ll intercept 75% of the times.

[Mestari]

Why are interceptions rare?

Because coaches try to avoid giving the opportunity.

Increasing the odds of completing an interception might actually make interceptions even more rare!

Trust me when I say that if you have an elf like Kri has, you could intercept a high enough portion of passes (Note: you are trying to bump up the change to intercept!) - but you won't get too many shots at trying one! Usually you get one when the opponent is excited about needing only a pass and a catch to score and forgets about the passblocker standing three squares away from the passing line

If odds for intercepting are made better, coaches will be even more strict on avoiding a pass that could be intercepted, thus resulting in less interception attempts -> and less interceptions.

Even though Thadrins suggestions sound interesting, we should bear in mind what's stated above. Making an interception (or knocking the ball out of its path) even slightly more likely, the amount of interception rolls will likely go down alot.
Many interceptions are made by AG1 or AG2 players because coaches (even though AG3 would be just as likely) are more inclined to throw over them, and the '6' usually comes up.

IF you want to increase the number of interceptions, you should make it easier to try an interception, not make it easier to complete one.

Solution 1:
Make the passing band wider, so that it's harder to fix a pass so that no-one can intercept

Solution 2:
Let the intercepting player (the one who makes the interception) move 1 square prior to the interception roll. Other PassBlockers are moved before he is. This move must take him into a position to intercept and he must try to intercept. If the player has Pass Block, he may move 4 squares. If he falls over due to a failed dodge or something like that, the interception opportunity is wasted.