The rugbyish/aussie/human #2 team

[Mestari]

NoS is a potent skill with DOff, however with agility three the forwards need it if they want to have any use out of dump off. Attempting a 2-dice block against the ball carrier (two TZ's on him), without NoS the dump off pass would be 1,2 fumble, 3,4 inaccurate, 5 accurate, which is not really appealing, especially if the opponent has (as he should) covered the receiving player with his own players to prevent him catching the ball. No rerolls, remember.
Looking it that way, for the team to really use dump off, they need to have NoS on some players, IMO.
I wouldn't, as an opposing coach, worry too much about DOff players without NoS, with AG 3 the ball can be arranged to go loose pretty easily, IMO, unless of course the opponent has managed to secure a receiver so that I can't put a TZ on him. But I could still probably make the possibility of success of the dump off pass really small.
An elf team where everyone has dump off... then I'd worry about the inbalancing factor of DOff.

BTW. What's the current ruling: can a dump off be intercepted?

So - how about dealing with both those things by letting the forwards have ST access rather than AG access. Furthermore, if you wanted to replace Stand Firm, perhaps good old mighty blow would show just how rough these players are!

I really dunno about MB - after all, not many starting players have it. Also I think Stand Firm is really rugbyish - a player attempting to move onward and staying on his feet even though there are several players attempting to tackle him down.
ST-skill access might be a good option - definitely better than agility skills which give them access to catch and dodge.


just remember that if every player on a rugby team had dump off, you'd never see a tackle...

I'm not completely sure I understand what you mean, Lucien. If everyone has DOff, there'd be no blocks, or what?

[lanky316]

Hey, I've been playing rugby for the last 10 years, since I was 7 and it was that reason I bought BB. I think this list seems quite balnced and entertaining to play with.

One option could be to give the halves a diving tackle. I don't want this to make them overpowered, but we do see a lot of "tap tackles" from the scrum/fly half, so it could make the game (even) more exiting.[/i]

[Marcus]

Coming back to this thread from elsewhere.

I really love this idea. I'd been thinking about a rugby style variant of bloodbowl for ages (no forward passes, no shepherding) but trying this team could be a lot of fun.

I have to say I think Thad's revised lineup looks the most sensible. The large amount of dumpoff would be an interesting one to play against. I've seen it used once before and it requires a very different approach to defence.

I might give these guys a scimmage and see how they play.

Marcus

[Mestari]

Well, surprisingly I still like my suggestion more

-If only position players have dump off, it kinda takes a lot away from the team concept. The linemen will rarely use it anyhow, so it definitely is not an overpowering factor. Sure the position players use it more, but why not let linemen have it too?

-Limited skill access is one thing I've felt was one of the best points in my suggestion.

-It's not supposed to be 1:1 with rugby - balance and design issues override such desires.

-The criticism on equal statlines is in place, however, and I've been thinking of changing Forwards to AV7 and Scrumhalves to MA 7 - even then the team is slower than the human team. I dropped Sure Hands from the Scrumhalves too - they don't need it (against strip ball) as they dump off the ball.

So the current suggestion would be something like:

Code: Select all

Albion team
0-4  Forward     7 3 3 7  SFirm,NoS,DOff 100k  Gen,Ag 90k
0-4  Scrumhalf   7 3 3 8  Pass,DOff 80k            Gen    80k
0-12 Lineman     6 3 3 8 DOff                        Gen    60k
RR:50k

I'm a bit hesitant with the forwards AV7 though: the teams success in our league at least has laid rather heavily on the shoulders of the forwards which were clearly the best position. It is also the only position with agility skill access. And now they are the most vulnerable players... So how about changing Forwards back to AV8 and giving scrumhalves AV7?

[Marcus]

I'd prefer to have the forwards without dump off and the halves with access to kicking skills myself. I think there's an interesting balance to be had by giving the forwards stand firm but not letting them release the ball. Kinda like once the forwards get hold of it it's just head down for the touchline.

The other reason for this is I don't like teams that all have one skill in common.

Still haven't tried the rules, might get a test game in soon, it looks like fun.

[Colin]

The other reason for this is I don't like teams that all have one skill in common.

You mean like those clones, the Norse and Amazons?

[Mestari]

I'd prefer to have the forwards without dump off and the halves with access to kicking skills myself. I think there's an interesting balance to be had by giving the forwards stand firm but not letting them release the ball. Kinda like once the forwards get hold of it it's just head down for the touchline.

You bought me with that one, Marcus!

What do you think: the team gets weakened a lot by that so should we give the forwards something in return?

Pass Block? Strip Ball? Dodge? Sure Hands?

Sure Hands might be a good one: now that they no longer release the ball, they'd hang to it instead...
Pass Block and Strip ball would make them more effective on defense also...
Opinions?

[Marcus]

I say the trade off is the halves get access to kicking skills. I want to see some chip and charge plays out to the forwards!

If you reckon they're still owed something then give the forwards block. Will help them with the obligatory "mauri sidestep". It will also have a similar effect to sure hands for being able to hang on to the ball.

[McDeth]

Surely there must be room for a dirty player or two to represent the second row forward activities

[Marcus]

You mean the French second rower activities.

No offence intended to French posters; but, fair's fair, you saw their behaviour last world cup

[Deathwing]

You mean the French second rower activities.

No offence intended to French posters; but, fair's fair, you saw their behaviour last world cup

LOL! Remember the Taffs going over to green socks against the French to help show exactly who was doing all the stamping?

[Mestari]

Ok, the team concept is advancing...

Now... one more run through the positions:

Lineman:
0-12 6 3 3 8 Doff 60k is fine, IMO

Forwards:
Definitely the best player on this team. Long- and short-term success will likely depend on effective use of the forwards.
Three options:

Code: Select all

A. 0-4 Forward 7 3 3 8 SFirm,NoS,Block Gen,Ag, 110k
B. 0-4 Forward 7 3 3 7 SFirm,NoS,Block Gen,Ag, 100k
C. 0-4 Forward 7 3 3 8 SFirm,NoS Gen,Ag, 100k

A. Is what we go for if we feel that the team is too vulnerable as it stands and really needs one superposition. A position that as a rookie beats the human blitzer easily, but is more agility-orientated in development.
B. Gives the team an excellent position, but keeps the enormous potential of the forwards in check by making them a bit more squishy.
C. gives the forwards less potential skill-wise, but makes them more durable.

Scrumhalves:
These are the players that keep the ball until they run into trouble, in which case the dump it off to the forwards...
I agree with Marcus that if using the kicking rules the team should have players with kicking access.

A.0-4 Scrumhalf 7 3 3 8 Pass,DOff Gen,Kick 80k
B.0-4 Scrumhalf 7 3 3 8 Pass,Kick,DOff Gen,Kick 90k

Opinions? I have mine already but I want to hear what you think...

[DoubleSkulls]

Shouldn't there be 2 types of forward?

The front 5 (props, hooker & 2nd row) are generally big, strong and not particularly good ball handlers. i.e. blocker types

The back row (flankers & No 8 ) are generally quick, tough and reasonably good on the ball i.e. blitzer types

Ian

[Mestari]

Well, my knowledge on rugby is rather limited, and the point wasn't to make a 1:1 rugby team to BB.

Instead this attempts to create a rugbyish concept which introduces a completely different team philosophy from the rest of the teams.

[Marcus]

ag on forwards just feels all wrong to me. Backs get ag, forwards barrel through the line. Break tackle and Stand firm are their hallmarks.

Give the halves access to ag unless you're playing kicking rules in which case give them kicking.

Give the forwards access to st and arm8 (even if a forward had a broken leg they would not leave the pitch). Std firm and NoS only

Linemen good as is (change names to backs)

That captures flavour while staying bloodbowly imho