(Un-)Living NecroTacticum: Necros vs the world of Blood Bowl

[Digger Goreman]

A little side trip:

Having slowly shed my habit of interminable tinkering to get just the right models for my four undead teams, and having enough lead under the bed to last my lifetime, I'm prepared to present my model picks for first team Necro allstars!

Position
01 Zombie gw Vomitflesh
02 Zombie gw Rotter 1
03 Zombie gw Rotter 2
04 Zombie gw Rotter 3
05 Zombie Mojonbowl Rotter
06 Zombie (racial alt, see below)
07 Journey Zombie citadel night horror golem
08 Jouney Zombie citadel night horror golem (head in hand)
09 Ghoul Heresy Deathball
10 Ghoul B7 Tournament
11 Wight Privateer Press Mechanithrall
12 Wight Privateer Press Mechanithrall (different sculpt)
13 Flesh Golem B7 Funk-n-Stein
14 Flesh Golem gw 5th edition golem
15 Werewolf gw Slarga Foulstrike
16 Werewolf gw Wilhelm Chaney
17 Zombie Citadel shambling zombie with vulture on shoulder

Racial Zombie alts
Dwarf Aarbl Tournament
Elf gw zombified Eldril
Orc gw zombified Greaser Geargrinder
Beastman gw zombified

Staff
Coach/Wilhelm Chaney, 2005 Belgian Tourney werewolf
Asst Coach, West Coast Quake Zelvis
Asst Coach, gw Frank-n-Stein
Asst Coach/Turn Marker, zombified Reaper Uncle Sam
Cheerleader/Reroll Marker, gw undead cheerleader
Cheerleader/TD Marker, gw khemri cheerleader

[Maverick]

I have had the same issue with werewolves, just ask my league mates I have about 20 different models

Currently playing with Albion cup were and the new vortice miniature.

[mattgslater]

The Zig is pretty standard but could you share what your other defenses look like?

Really, I only use 5 defenses, ever.

* Ziggurat, usually with or vs speed;
* 303 nickel boat, usually vs bash;
* 32023 stacked second level, usually with midrange vs speed;
* asymmetric sideline defense, with speed and skills;
* stacked LOS, vs. crippled opponent.

Ziggurat:

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Boat:

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Boat variant: "Battleship"

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[Digger Goreman]

The Zig is pretty standard but could you share what your other defenses look like?

Really, I only use 5 defenses, ever.

* Ziggurat, usually with or vs speed;
* 303 nickel boat, usually vs bash;
* 32023 stacked second level, usually with midrange vs speed;
* asymmetric sideline defense, with speed and skills;
* stacked LOS, vs. crippled opponent.

Ziggurat:

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Which one do you prefer against Necros, as I think I could surf the Zig's deepest winger with one wight and a couple of wolves....

[DixonCider]

Having a spirited debate with a friend about if it is better to play a necro team with or without the ghouls. What is the consensus here?

[swilhelm73]

My take is that a necro team needs ghouls as ball carriers. Your wights and wolves have other roles, and if you are forced to use one as your ball carrier you are weakening your team overall.

Also, your team speed on defence is significantly increased with them on the pitch.

They will die but such is bloodbowl.

[Smeborg]

Having a spirited debate with a friend about if it is better to play a necro team with or without the ghouls. What is the consensus here?

I have seen a Necro team without Ghouls do quite well (but not outstandingly so) in a league. Its advantages were lower TV (hence inducements - the coach liked to take Setekh and Wilhelm Chaney), and greater resilience (no AV7, all players with Regen), leading to better retention of SPPs. Such a team is also easier to start.

I would not play the team myself without Ghouls, but that is partly a matter of temperament. My "system", once I have all the positional players is normally to play only 1 Ghoul on defense, leaving the Ghoul Runner for offense only (assuming I have a full team, of course).

Making a Wight into a decent Runner (or even into a Thrower if you get lucky) is perfectly feasible. The downside is that you may miss the utility skills of a "normal" Wight (Guard, Tackle, M-Blow).

The main downsides to a Ghoul-less strategy are the reduction in aggregate MA from 62 to 56, and the reduction in the number of AG3 players from 6 to 4 (more like a Dwart team). These are quite severe limitations in my view, so while I think a Ghoul-less team is viable, I doubt whether it can be great. Of course if you play in an environment where Ghouls will be slaughtered as soon as they set foot on the pitch, then a Ghoul-less strategy may be more appealing.

Hope that helps.

[Maverick]

Personally I tend to start without ghouls in a league setting but always make it my first purchase, they skill up easily as your main ball carrier so quickly catch up, in tournaments I wouldn't be without at least one, dependant on TV allowed.

[swilhelm73]

and the reduction in the number of AG3 players from 6 to 4 (more like a Dwart team). These are quite severe limitations in my view, [...]

Hope that helps.

To extend this thought, Dwarves have two designated hitters in the Troll Slayers, two ball carriers in the runners, and two blitzers which are in between.

This is very similar to Necro with the WWs, Ghouls, and Wights.

However, imagine dwarf team that went without runners and carried the ball with the TS and BZs primarily. Would it limit them significantly? I think the answer is yes.

[DixonCider]

thanks Maverick, Smeborg, and swilhelm73. I am thinking this may be one of the reasons my win/loss ratio was so low(other than I am rubbish).

[mattgslater]

Usually I use an interior defense vs teams with slow cogs. The key to defending vs Necros is to force them to redirect with only their speed players, and that often means loading up at the point of attack on the first turn.

[Digger Goreman]

Having a spirited debate with a friend about if it is better to play a necro team with or without the ghouls. What is the consensus here?

It depends on when for me.... At creation it is hard to carry all positionals... you must start with only one reroll.... More rerolls and you must sacrifice something... ghouls often being part of that equation....

So why SHOULD a ghoul be included...? Most reliable dodger, second fastest player and best ag for the team.... Why NOT include a ghoul...? Soft target with no regen and NO freakin access to an apothecary....

I feel, now, that one ghoul (at creation) is a good idea.... You will be protecting the ball carrier anyway, so it might as well be your one ghoul.... 5 zeds, 2 golems, 2 wights and a werewolf should be able to do it.... Even when you have a second ghoul on a 12+ man team, running one at a time is my suggestion....

Tactically, any ghoul is great for reaching the ball after a wolf blitzes it free... and the more speedsters you have the harder it is for your opponet to protect his ball carrier....

It all comes down to how much risk, reward, and opportunity costs you are willing to accept in your game....

[Hegel]

I´m playing a necro team in our tabletop league and they are doing quite well (W/L/D : 3/4/4). We are playing random MVP, but I´ve been kind of lucky. Atm my team is

Golem, Block, <new skill, rolled a double>
Golem, Block
Wight (brand new replacement for his killed predecessor)
Wight, +ST
Wolf, Block, Dodge, Mighty Blow
Wolf, Block, +Ag
Ghoul, Sure Hands
Ghoul, Guard
Zed, Block
Zed, Block
Zed
Zed
Zed

The general agreement seems to be Guard for the Golem, although I quite like the idea of Dodge to make him a really reliable cage corner. ST4 Wight wll get Mighty Blow next, the other Wight probably Tackle, both Ghouls are waiting for Block. AG4 Wolf will probably get Dodge.

This thread was and is very helpful, thanks a lot !

[mattgslater]

Dodge is awesome on Golems. Guard next, then Break Tackle or Mighty Blow, either way take Tackle at 76.

I like keeping both Ghouls. Yes they take 3x as much damage as Zombies (well, 5/3 times as much after Dodge), but they're so much more effective on the pitch.

[Maverick]

Dodge is great as a third skill, however as a first skill it sucks -- rolled doubles on my golem first skill took guard,

Golems work great with Block Guard, those two skills and anything else is icing on the cake, (possibly grab to make the OTS easier but thats more situational)

Doubles on the second skill has to be weighed up against if that golem is likely to skill up again fine in a perpetual league unlikely in a short term league.