Talk Fantasy Football

Okiday I've been playing a few matches using Norse against Vampires and have found a couple of queries to ask about the vampire teams bloodlusting....

Once the Bloodlust has failed the vamp is restricted to a move action, that much is perfectly clear, what we're slightly confused by is whether they can pull off hypnotic gaze or hand offs at the end of the move if....
a) They manage to suck a Thrall

b) They don't manage to suck a Thrall and are carted off to the reserves box

Cheers in advance for the help.

They bite before they gaze, as you do the biting at the end of the move and the gaze at the end of the Move Action.
Subtle difference.

If they bite, they can also gaze because you gaze at the end of a Move Action and a failed Bloodlust means the Vampire takes a Move Action.

If you don't bite, you are moved to Reserves before you can gaze.

I'm assuming the same applies to handing off the ball too then? and Thanks for clearing that up.

They can't hand off the ball if they fail a BL roll, because you can only hand off at the end of a Hand Off action. And Blood Lust changes whatever action has been declared into a Move Action. Which is not a Hand Off Action.

Hypnotic Gaze:

The player may use hypnotic gaze at the end of his Move Action on one opposing player who is in an adjacent square.

Blood Lust:

If the Vampire finishes the move standing adjacent to one or more standing, Prone or Stunned Thralls from his own team, he attacks one of them.

Hypnotic Gaze is something you do as part of you Move Action. However the use of Hypnotic Gaze finishes your Move Action. The trigger for Blood Lust checking to see who is adjacent is the Move Action finishing. So you could always use Hypnotic Gaze when a Vampire fails a Blood Lust roll. If no Thralls are next to him after he uses the skill, then the Vampire would leave the pitch and it would be a turnover. If there is a Thrall, then after using Gaze he would bite the Thrall.

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Fen already got the Hand-off part right. A Hand-off can only be done during a Hand-off Action. Since a failed Blood Lust roll is only a Move Action ... the Vampire cannot hand-off the ball.

Galak

GalakStarscraper wrote: Hypnotic Gaze is something you do as part of you Move Action. However the use of Hypnotic Gaze finishes your Move Action. The trigger for Blood Lust checking to see who is adjacent is the Move Action finishing. So you could always use Hypnotic Gaze when a Vampire fails a Blood Lust roll. If no Thralls are next to him after he uses the skill, then the Vampire would leave the pitch and it would be a turnover. If there is a Thrall, then after using Gaze he would bite the Thrall.

Galak

So you like to fluffily justify things. How do you justify that?!? He's crazy with blood lust but hey, I just moved 6 squares, is there anything I want to do before I leave the pitch? Oh yeah. @@@@you loose your tackle zone@@@@. poof. He's off and it's a turnover.

That's dumb.

Snew wrote:That's dumb.

No more so than picking up the ball and moving it to a better part of the pitch before he runs off the pitch.

The problem is Steve you are often way too quick to suggest that fluff made a rule (its like your BB blind spot because you hate fluff so much). Let's try the fact in this case that the rule becomes ungodly worded if you try and forbid using skills like Hypnotic Gaze or picking up the ball ... but allow things like using Dodge, Leap, Sure Feet, etc. In the end ... its a game and its was NOT fluff that drove this decision but the fact that something like not allowing H Gaze to work is not worth including multiple sentences trying to pick and choose what he can and cannot do.

Galak

Well, the entire description is 17+ lines long and the last 3 lines worth of text make it clear it's the intention of the rule to allow anything in a move action to take place. I'm betting it works and says exactly what you wanted/needed it to say. It's fine if it's simply a mechanic to make them bad but not too bad but you in particular love to explain things to me along more fluffy lines and I don't see it here. I was hoping you'd explain it to me.

It's true. I think fluff causes bad rules to be written and poor rules spawn bad fluff which will them cause to rule to be rewritten even worse to make it fit the fluff originally spun off the rule. Vicious cycle.

Note that the
Vampire is allowed to pick up the ball or do anything else they could
normally do while taking a Move Action, but must bite a Thrall to avoid
the turnover.

I'm tired of griping about fluff though. On another note, this note is in reality a FAQ that was put into the rules as was suggested in another thread. All FAQs should be incorporated into the reles this way.

Snew wrote:It's fine if it's simply a mechanic to make them bad but not too bad but you in particular love to explain things to me along more fluffy lines and I don't see it here. I was hoping you'd explain it to me.

I will try in the future to not give you a fluff based answer to a question at all if it is purely game mechanic driven.

In this case with Blood Lust ... the wording is purely game mechanic driven.

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As for the FAQs. I am very open to trying to put all of them into the actual rules if someone wants to take each one and show me how to do so. I honestly worked for several weeks taking the original 3 pages of FAQs and merging them into the rules to get it down to 1 page. But I could not see an easy way to get the one page into the rules as well.

Mo had a suggestion about deleting a pic or DYK and putting the full passing sequence on the page after the passing rules (ie the page with the catching rules). I don't think this would be a problem .. I'd prefer it on the same page as the passing rules .. but I could see it on the next page.

There is a thread over on FUMBBL trying to reword Multiple Block to get rid of some of the FAQs on that skill as well ... and is finally starting to show some signs of promise.

I've very open to FAQ removal ... its just its a LOT easier to type "you should get rid of the FAQs" than it is to actually get rid of them.

Galak

So Vamps should be able to hypnotic gaze after failing bloodlust, but they can't hand-off the ball.

And it's not a turnover if they don't bite a thrall unless they were holding the ball?

or if they bite the thrall holding the ball that's a TO because the Thrall is going to drop the ball automatically (he's going to be stunned at best and dead at worst)

Buggrit wrote:And it's not a turnover if they don't bite a thrall unless they were holding the ball?

This was the only part you had wrong. If a Vampire does not bite a Thrall it is always a turnover.

Galak

Hi all,
i'm new to this forum, but a longtime BB-Player, haven't played too much with LRB5 yet.
So, if the vampire failed his bloodlust-roll, and while performing his mandatory move action, he tries to pick up the ball, fails, i.e. turnover, is the vampire removed from the pitch, because he hasn't bitten a thrall yet?

olsen667 wrote: is the vampire removed from the pitch, because he hasn't bitten a thrall yet?

correct

Thanks for the quick answer, that'll lighten things up.

Hi! Yesterday when playing a game against vampires a rules querie showed up. If a vampire who fails his bloodlust ends up in the endzone with the ball next to a thrall, does he still bite the thrall? Since it didnt mather too much yesterday we let the vamp bite the thrall and when get his TD. But is this correct? Or do you score the TD and then because you are so happy you forget to bite the thrall?