4th Edition - How BB was ruined?

For Fantasy Football related chat that doesn't come under any of other forum categories.

Moderator: TFF Mods

WraithNeon
Rookie
Rookie
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2003 12:16 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

4th Edition - How BB was ruined?

Post by WraithNeon »

Im new to these forums but I have been playing BloodBowl ever since the new game (third ed) came out! And I must admit I LOVE the rules as they were. :D In my opinion the rules were amazing! Elf teams ran, leaped and dodged, blitzers blocked and dodged, undead teams shambled (but still got beat the daylights out of other teams), and all the others with their unique feels.
So, the question is, why oh why did the game designers in all their infinite wisdom decide to ruin the rules and radically alter the way you play the game?
For example, the new one skill use per player per team go. Now I know bloodbowl isnt designed to realisticly depict the way a game of US football is played, but it IS realistic to expect a guy to dodge once, dodge twice, dodge a third guy then score! Or dodge one guy then run up to another and manage to block him through a skill he has.
When you take a step back and look at what that has basicly done to all the teams is make them pretty much all the same.
Another example (Dodge and Dirty player): Just because an evil player uses his skill to dodge away from a opposing player doesn mean hes any less evil when he comes to making the foul he was running to.
And then theres the 3rd ed. skills vs the 4th ed. traits and skills. Now I do agree with some of the traits (like 'Take root' for treemen) but these should still be just 'special rules' for individuals. Some of the reasons for why some traits cant be 'learnt' are rubbish! Reread the 'Frenzy' reasons (if you have access to the new 4th ed.).
Give me 3rd edition anyday, where you can dodge, pickup the ball, run, sprint, pass, catch, dodge, run, dodge, hand off, dodge, run, sprint and score from one endzone to ther other IN TRUE STYLE! :D

Reason: ''
martynq
Super Star
Super Star
Posts: 1251
Joined: Thu May 02, 2002 11:21 am
Location: Cupar, Fife, Scotland

Post by martynq »

The fourth edition rules have since been abandoned (quite a long time ago!) and been replaced by the Living Rulebook which is somewhat closer to 3rd edition... though much better IMHO.

Other than that... what on earth are you going on about?

In 3rd edition, you could only use the Dodge skill once in each player's action.

In 4th edition, you could use Dodge and Dirty Player in the same action.

Martyn

Reason: ''
Dark Elf Blitzer 8/3/4/8 Block, Dodge, MA+1, Shadowing, Side Step, Tackle
Deathwing
The Voice of Reason
Posts: 6449
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2001 12:00 am
Contact:

Post by Deathwing »


Reason: ''
Image

"Deathwing treats newcomers like sh*t"
"...the brain dead Mod.."
Deathwing
The Voice of Reason
Posts: 6449
Joined: Tue Jun 26, 2001 12:00 am
Contact:

Post by Deathwing »

martynq wrote: In 4th edition, you could use Dodge and Dirty Player in the same action.
*Best Pantomime Voice..*

Oooooh no you couldn't!

Reason: ''
Image

"Deathwing treats newcomers like sh*t"
"...the brain dead Mod.."
martynq
Super Star
Super Star
Posts: 1251
Joined: Thu May 02, 2002 11:21 am
Location: Cupar, Fife, Scotland

Post by martynq »

Oops, dead right... stupid me... or rather... stupid 4th edition. :roll:

Martyn

Reason: ''
Dark Elf Blitzer 8/3/4/8 Block, Dodge, MA+1, Shadowing, Side Step, Tackle
Redfang
Legend
Legend
Posts: 4503
Joined: Fri Oct 04, 2002 11:18 am
Location: With the wife, watching Zara and the Hasslefree chick from behind their bedroom curtain...

Post by Redfang »

Well in defence of 4th edition

The basic rules for buying/using Secret weapon were better IMHO

Reason: ''
Ik wou dat ik twee blondjes was,
Dan kon ik samen spelen.

[size=67][url=http://www.talkbloodbowl.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=14334]Bragging[/url][/size]

What keeps me busy nowadays: [url=http://www.bruchius.com/]Fun with violence.[/url]
User avatar
roysorlie
Emerging Star
Emerging Star
Posts: 449
Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2002 1:12 pm
Location: Stavanger, Norway

Post by roysorlie »

The LRB is much better than 4th ed. We never even bothered to use it.l Justkept on using 3rd.

LRB is better than 3ed, cept I don't like aging, the way it is, but agree with it's intention. I don't like losing the cards, cuz the handicap table is either useless, or devastating. And dull in any event. But as I understand, GW (or was it fanatic?) lost the printout file for the cards.. so. Make em anew goddammit.

And, also the way rookie teams have nothing to gain from playing higher TR teams, while the high TR team has lot's to gain. (should be the other way round)

Yes.

Reason: ''
Roy

Norwegian National Tournament Organizer.

Coachname [url=http://fumbbl.com/~SnakeEyes]SnakeEyes[/url] on [url=http://fumbbl.com/]fumbbl.com[/url]
NAF member 187
Marcus
Da Tulip Champ I
Posts: 1664
Joined: Thu Jan 01, 1970 12:00 am
Location: Australian in London
Contact:

Post by Marcus »

3rd edition was great - but I couldn't lose with Woodelves, no matter how hard I tried.
4th edition was, I think, bold experiment. A lot of it was wrong, some of it was right
LRB is pretty much bang on. Never seen a better balance between the teams. Stylish coast to coasts are still perfectly possible, you've just got to be good to do it now, rather than just, oooh, coach a woodelf team and roll dice ;)

Reason: ''
Marcus - [url=http://www.talkbloodbowl.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?p=42448#42448]Hall of Famer[/url] - [url=http://www.irwilliams.com/ecbbl/index.php]Edinboro Castle Blood Bowl League[/url]
narkotic
Da Collector
Posts: 3760
Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 4:27 pm

Post by narkotic »

I switched from 2nd ed to LRB, skipping the rest. That tells everything (probably it tells nothing at all :roll: , but I agree on that LRB is the best version in BB history)

Reason: ''
User avatar
Sixpack595
Super Star
Super Star
Posts: 893
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 2:00 am
Location: Detroit
Contact:

Post by Sixpack595 »

3rd ed was the best, LRB is OK, and 4th was garbage. 4th was a huge mistake, and really hurt the game. Alot of players around here quit, and didn't start up again.

Reason: ''
User avatar
Zombie
Legend
Legend
Posts: 2245
Joined: Tue Aug 13, 2002 4:07 pm
Location: Montreal, Quebec, Canada

Post by Zombie »

4th was great, better than 3rd. And even if you don't agree with that, you've still got to respect how it put BB back on the map when it was falling into oblivion.

Reason: ''
User avatar
Dave
Info Ed
Posts: 8090
Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2002 8:19 am
Location: Riding my Cannondale

Post by Dave »

Agree on that zombie but LBR is top of my list!

Reason: ''
Image
User avatar
MistWraith
Emerging Star
Emerging Star
Posts: 501
Joined: Sun Nov 03, 2002 11:59 pm
Location: Springfield, MO

Post by MistWraith »

4th Ed. was not bad, just diffrent. I do not see what all the fuss is over it.

3rd was broken, it degenerated into who could get the most fouls off with dirty players. Scoring was secondary for most teams.

LRB is the best so far (that I have played I missed 1st and 2nd). It needs a few tweakes to be perfect, but that is why it is still a work in progress.

Reason: ''
WraithNeon
Rookie
Rookie
Posts: 8
Joined: Tue Feb 18, 2003 12:16 pm
Location: UK
Contact:

Thanks guys!

Post by WraithNeon »

Well, thanks to everyone whos replied so far! I must admit I havent read LRB yet :roll: but Im going to make it a priority.

I think it would be fair in saying that most people disliked the 4th ed. due to the unthought out rehash of skills and rules. I wouldnt go so far as one of you did, saying 4th ed. killed BB! I ran a tournament after they came out at GW Maidstone. We used 3rd ed. rules (Which I still think are the finest) and we got a very good turn out of teams. Everybody was happy to use 3rd ed.

One last point...Woodelves arent so unbeatable. You just need to pick the right club! hehehehehe :P

Reason: ''
User avatar
Sixpack595
Super Star
Super Star
Posts: 893
Joined: Fri Dec 20, 2002 2:00 am
Location: Detroit
Contact:

Post by Sixpack595 »

I disagree , but we already knew that didn't we? :lol:

We had a league start just as 4th came out, and it put a stop to it real quick. Half the people dropped out, the other half bitched about it. Around here it pushed BB into oblivion untill people started in on LRB. And about all I see 4th ed doing is bringing things like the BBRC into being...I'm still not sure if thats a good thing or a bad thing. I think simply rereleasing it would have been better than the 4th ed debacle.

Zombie wrote:4th was great, better than 3rd. And even if you don't agree with that, you've still got to respect how it put BB back on the map when it was falling into oblivion.

Reason: ''
Post Reply