Talk Fantasy Football

Not sure what area this falls under but I'll post it here for now. I'm looking at Chaos and Nurgle as two potential teams that I can use in the near future. We recently had a Chaos player become champion in our league so it isn't hard to see why they can become so good. Having linemen with a normal stat line and horns is a great all around player with potential to become specialists easily. The warriors are arguably the best ST 4 player in the game having a solid stat line and access to a plethora of skills making them power houses once developed. The Minotaur is one of the most reliable Big Guys in the game with Wild Animal and having one skill access to Claw/Mighty Blow without needing a double is just so good.

Nurgle on the other hand is an interesting team. They are sort of undead with their Nurgle's Rot and Regeneration but not undead. Their Rotters are pretty bad linemen/generic players. Below average movement and decay makes them very poor. Their low cost does help make up for that. The Pestigors can become specialists very easily. Problem though is they are just Chaos Beastmen who can regenerate. I'm ignoring the "Nurgle's Rot" skill because to me that is just essentially undead's raise dead. So instead of getting a team of 6 beast men to accompany your already stacked front line of 4 warriors and a minotaur, Nurgle gets 4 pestigors to join up with the sub-par rotters. Getting to one of the best players on the team is the Warrior. They can slow the passing game, they can mess up the bash teams, and they hit back as hard. They are easily better than a Black Orc and other similar positional players but they seem to be lacking something. Be it the MA4, or AG 2 they strike me as very difficult to level up. Once leveled up they can specialize easier than a Chaos Warrior for sure but the time it takes might be too long. Finally we end with the Beast of Nurgle. He obviously also can mess up passing and bash games with his foul appearance/disturbing presence. Tentacles is a great skill and really can mess up anyone's game, plus in an agile league give a warrior or two tentacles and you can really screw up agile teams. But then he has really stupid. Which, correct me if I'm wrong, if it fails he loses the DP/FA abilities right? But with no access to mutations on normal skills that doubles is tricky on what to give him. Does he get claws? Prehensile tail? Block?

So I gave my two descriptions of the teams. From what I can see on the surface I know the strengths and weaknesses of each. Now with that said what are the advantages of each that you all have experienced? I would love to know so I am best equipped whenI decide to use one of these teams.

If my experience is in question (not because you think I'm bad but in case you wonder how I play) I have used three teams primarily. Dark Elf (won the championship), High Elf (lost in the finals to above mentioned Chaos), and Dwarf (who I've had about a .500 record with) I seem to excel better playing an agile team and Wood Elf is probably next, maybe Skaven if I use agile but as for bash which of these do you think I can best utilize? Thanks in advance guys.

Chaos mate, all the way. Nurgle start with a pestigor; maybe two. You're not going to want to be skilling up rotters all that much given they die - compared to a rotter a beastman is +MA, horns, no Decay and S access for a bargain 20k.

If you're more about the ability to actually do stuff with dudes, and start with a bit of flexibility out of their, Chaos out of the two - even the warriors are capable scorers.

Either of the teams take patience early on, but if you want to just kill stuff and have all the advantages later on, go Chaos. If you want to kill stuff and have to think about your moves to control the pitch, go Nurgle.

Nurgle suits a slightly different take than Chaos. You can ClawPOMB your Warriors, but adding Tentacles to one or two adds a different dimension to the team entirely. Rotters are a bit on the crap side, but you will pick a free one up occasionally, so once you have bought your starting amount don't add anymore.

Ultimately they are both similar enough that you will have fun either

bizzydog217 wrote:But then he has really stupid. Which, correct me if I'm wrong, if it fails he loses the DP/FA abilities right?

Neither skill requires an active tackle zone to work and Disturbing Presence even works if the player is lying down on the floor (prone or stunned).

What the beast does lose, if you fail a Really Stupid roll, is Tentacles, as that does require an active tackle zone.

My take on Nurgle (and contrasts with Chaos):

Develop very slowly
a) because your warriors are generally only going to skillup via cas (unlike CWars who have the ag to handle the ball)
b) because their positionals are very expensive - you can never get them all in a starting team and it will take you several matches to pick them all up (even assuming you are not having to replace any)

Have a plethora of annoyance skills
Foul Appearance, Disturbing Presence, Tentacles - all of these will at some point cause your opponent a problem they didn't anticipate, causing reroll burn or outright blocking their plans.

Have possibly the best combination of strength and endurance in high TV bashing
FA + regen on five of the key players + ClawPOMB + high ST means they can go toe to toe with anything.

Have cheap fodder for LOS and fouling duty
Rotters are not bad with av8 but will explode when hit hard. At 40k though who cares? They can run a very viable fouling game with a good TV risk/reward proposition.

Have one of the best big guys in the game
Regen, FA, Tents - yes please. I'm not a great fan of the Minotaur at higher TV. Av8 makes him a liability, and he is very expensive tv wise. I don't see a lot of high tv Chaos teams on FUMBBL run with the mino (though there are some incredible ones out there).


Overall, I think Nurgle are way more interesting than Chaos, and I think they win the bashing war at high TV. They also present real problems out of the box to Elf teams. But developing them as a team can be extremely painful. Chaos have far greater versatility in how they build, are better earlier in TV, have far better ball-handling options, and are just as terrifying at causing cas.

I love the crunch of the Nurgle team, I think they're far more interesting than straight Chaos. Nurgle Warriors are tougher and slower than Chaos Warriors, much better optimized for their role of standing on the front line and grinding in the trenches. I personally think that a few Pestigors and many expendable rotters is a better balance than just lots of Beastmen - only one beastman can use Horns per turn, it's wasted on the rest. Team Value adds up but I feel like Nurgle can more easily carry a "fouling bench".

And of course, Minotaur vs Beast. The Minotaur really isn't a front-line kind of player - his low armor makes that risky against many opponents. Wild Animal and Horns mean he's most effective when he's blitzing, but if you do that, you lose a sixth of your blitz actions. Frenzy and Loner and not having Block WILL get you in trouble and cause turnovers. I do think the Minotaur is important on a Chaos team, you need his Strength is you're going to stand up to other basher teams, but on my Chaos team I've always felt like he's a liability who needs to be protected.
Compare that to the Beast of Nurgle, who is nearly perfect for line duty. Mainly because he can be very effective even if you rarely activate him, especially once he has Guard. (Beasts take forever to skill but at least they tend to last a while).

I think Nurgle's specialty skills (Disturbing Presence and Foul Appearance) are fun and underrated. DP can be insanely good against passing teams, although it takes careful positioning. FA is more of a bonus when it works than something you count on, but there are 1's on the die and I know from bitter experience how much it sucks to waste a reroll just to be allowed to block.


So why don't I play Nurgle in Blood Bowl? Fluff reasons. Back in Warhammer days I thought Tzeentch was the best Chaos God, painted some Chaos units appropriately, enjoyed improbable success when Battlefleet Gothic came out and I painted ships in Tzeentch colors. (looks really badass on those models too). The Chaos Gods are jealous gods, and if I were to coach a Nurgle team, I'm pretty sure I would be considered an apostate. What happens when Lord Tzeentch is angered? It's not pretty.

Nurgle is worse early, but it's better than Chaos at high TV, so if you plan to stick to your team for a long time I suggest Nurgle.
Nurgle Warriors earn Spps slowly until they get Block, Mighty Blow, then the Spps rate improves as they get further bashing skills, once they have Clawpomb they rack Spps fast.
You have to be patient during the first games.

rolo wrote:I do think the Minotaur is important on a Chaos team, you need his Strength is you're going to stand up to other basher teams, but on my Chaos team I've always felt like he's a liability who needs to be protected.

The Minotaur sucks and Chaos doesn't need him, even if you can play with a Minotaur for fun he's not worth his TV.

it's sad that the Beast does not have access to M-skill on simple

it's sad as well, that the "free-rotters" (from killing) are not usable like the free-zombies during the game they were raised

it would improve a lot nurgle (which is very bad at low TV... and very hard/slow to develop)

MattDakka wrote:Nurgle is worse early, but it's better than Chaos at high TV, so if you plan to stick to your team for a long time I suggest Nurgle.

This is the essential thing. The question is, will you be able to actually get to this point, or will the structure of your league make it unlikely?

My league is ever evolving. If you look at our champions they go (in season order) Dark Elf, Chaos Dwarf, Elf, Dark Elf, Skaven, Orc, Chaos. So we fluctuate with bash and pass and there really is no one way of going about it. I'm sure if I wanted I could keep the Nurgle on the field a while and not worry too much about getting obliterated. The Chaos player's minotaur became infamous in our league. He had Block, Claws, Mighty Blow, Juggernaut, Tentacles, and more. He was one of the infamous killers but I can see how the coach who used him relied on him too much to do things like the blitz when it was safer with some of his ridiculously good Warriors.

Are the Nurgle Warriors best to go ClawPOMB? It seems heavy on the kill factor and laying your warriors down with only 1 MA once standing can be tough, I've never had a ClawPOMB before so I could be mistaken.

Pestigors would get the proper skill allotment making them effective killers or scorers or disruptors right? Rotters themselves would take block, one with kick, maybe give them something like dirty player or other specialists who can become claw guys, big hand, two heads, prehensile tail etc. Do I have at least the right direction here?

As for fluff itself, what Chaos God do the Dark Elves worship? They have been my best team so far I played amassing a lot of casualties and scoring a lot. Won the Season 4 title and the only blemishes on my record were 2 ties.

The minis I'm getting are more geared towards Nurgle and I'm always up for a challenge. The Nurgle Warriors seem to be crazy good at high TV and I like high TV teams. That Beast is a beast. He controls so much of the field by doing NOTHING.

Chaos does seem choppy. Beast men all have the same skill which only works on a blitz. The Minotaur cancels out that skill if he blitzes, and then they are nothing special as far as players go. Nurgle can field 9 players that don't suck and 2 that do suck. That is almost as good as it can get when fielding solid players and linemen.

Dark elves favour Slaanesh and Khaine, which is basically khorne.

bizzydog217 wrote:
Are the Nurgle Warriors best to go ClawPOMB? It seems heavy on the kill factor and laying your warriors down with only 1 MA once standing can be tough, I've never had a ClawPOMB before so I could be mistaken.

Yes, it's the best combo they can get, and lying on the pitch is fine, because their victim will be probably injured. Moreover, if they lie on the pitch they are safe from opponent clawpombers (although they could be fouled, but if you protect them with some team mates they should be relatively safe).

bizzydog217 wrote:
Pestigors would get the proper skill allotment making them effective killers or scorers or disruptors right? Rotters themselves would take block, one with kick, maybe give them something like dirty player or other specialists who can become claw guys, big hand, two heads, prehensile tail etc. Do I have at least the right direction here?

-You need just one Pestigor ball carrier with some of the following stats/skills if possible: MA 7/AG 4; Sure Hands, Two Heads, Block, Dodge.
- Rotters are not supposed nor expected to get more than 1 or 2 skills each, they are essentially fodder to place on the LOS, cheap foulers, screeners, and assisting players.
They are good with either Block, Wrestle (if you lack Tackle during the early development of your team and you face Blodgers) or Dirty Player, let Claw to your good players (Nurgle Warriors and Pestigors), you want to get the SPPs on them, not on Rotters because too many skills on a Rotter are generally wasted (remember that they have Decay, AV 8, no Regeneration, so they die quite often, if you stack SPPs on them you are building a house on quick sands) and if they get too expensive they can't fulfil anymore the fodder/fouler role properly.
Forget the funky mutations like Big Hand, Two Heads, Prehensile Tail on Rotters, they are not worth on them.
If a Rotter rolls a double, though, you could consider to take either Leader or Guard, especially if your team is young and you need a cheap Re-roll.

MattDakka wrote:Nurgle is worse early, but it's better than Chaos at high TV...

Oh?

bizzydog217 wrote: Are the Nurgle Warriors best to go ClawPOMB?

UW blitzer is the best potential ClawPOMBer of the game.
starting with block...
and very fast (so you could hide him more easily after a blitz when PO is not used)