Let's all work together! - Ogre Team

[Ghost of Pariah]

A while back on the BBC message board some of us hammered out a nice Bret team. I loved it. (The BBRC, of course, didn't) It was a great collaboration.
I'm hoping to repeat the experience because I really dislike the Snotling(ogre) team.

Anyway, if you wanna reply to this please try to suggest something. Even if it's just a tweak of something already posted. The idea here is construction not destruction. If you don't like it but don't have anything that you feel is better well...then go away.

Here's my first suggestion from another thread.

0-12 Linemen 60K 5 4 2 8 Bonehead -Gen
0-2 Blockers 120K 5 5 2 9 Mighty Blow, Bonehead –Gen, ST
0-4 Runners 80K 6 4 2 8 Bonehead –Gen, PA
Rerolls 80K

[Colin]

I don't really like the idea of Ogre runners, I would change them to blitzers. Ogres in 2ed were either blockers or blitzers. Keep the same states as the runners for the blitzers and give them ST skills instead of passing. To me this would be more in tune with the history and feel of an Ogre team.

[Darkson]

Just wondering if the Linemen (lineorges?) should be 70k?

[Ghost of Pariah]

Yeah, you have a point. Don't you think that MA 6 and ST 4 would be too much for ST skill access? Maybe raise their price? If I added blitzers I would definitely make the Blockers MA 4.


Darkson. I had it at 70K originally but it was difficult to put together a roster so I lowered it.
How's this...

0-12 Linemen 70K 5 4 1 8 Bonehead, Thick Skull -Gen
0-4 Blockers 120K 5 5 2 9 Mighty Blow, Thick Skull, TTM, Bonehead –Gen, ST
0-2 Blitzers 100K 6 4 2 8 Block, Bonehead, Thick Skull –Gen, ST
Rerolls 80K

[Grumbledook]

bull centaurs have mv 6 st 4

[Ithilkir]

Well this is my Ogre League version so isn't balanced against the basic rosters.

(re-post from Missing Teams thread)

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Well I might be starting a PBeM/Jave Client Ogre team only league and came up with the following Ogre team

Code: Select all

Qty    Position                Mv St Ag Av   Skills & Traits          Cost       Skill Groups 
0-12   Ogre Lineman            5  4  2  9    Bone Head, Thick Skull   100,000    Gn, St 
0-6    Positional Ogres 
-      Ogre Blocker            5  5  2  9    Bone Head, Mighty Blow   120,000    Gn, St 
                                             Thick Skull 
-      Ogre Blitzer            6  4  2  9    Bone Head, Break Tackle  120,000    Gn, St 
                                             Thick Skull 

* You can only have a total of 6 positional Ogres on the team. eg 3 blockers and 3 blitzers, or 5 blockers and 1 blitzer 

Re-Roll: 100,000 
Starting Team Gold: 1,500,000

This is NOT balanced compared to general rosters, this is only balanced in an all ogre league

TTM was removed simply because of no team mates to throw. No re-rolls allowed on Big Guys was removed for this team only. If I was to add goblins or snotlings to the roster, then I'd up the positional players to 8, add in a thrower position (5428, Bone Head, TTM, Pass, 120k) and allow goblins or snotlings to be added to the team as positional players.

Going by 2e fluff however (I'm a firm believer in sticking to fluff) there were only Ogre blitzers and blockers, and the Oldheim Ogres did import some human throwing and kicking talent for the last NAF season before collapse (we never find out how they did...).

An all ogre team will not be balanced in general leagues without serious fudging. But then, they shouldn't be balanced. They SHOULD be weaker than any of the other rosters (halfings/goblins excluded), the problem is having a team filled with Strength 5 players being anything other than unbalanced.

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From fluff we know (as mentioned above) that the Oldheim Ogres imported Human kicking, throwing and catching talent. This opens up a chance for Human players on the roster. We also know (Treeman fluff from 2e) that the O. Ogres had at least one snotling on the team roster (Trashcar Daggerplague).

Stat wise the differences between Ogre Blitzers and Blockers was +1 SP (Sprint Distance), +1 AG and +1 CL (Cool, the ability to catch the ball). Armour, strength etc were the same, not a great difference in 2e since Ogres made people go splat 99% of the time.

I think if we go for an all Ogre team we need to work out a basic affordable Ogre first of all then work out from there, trying to keep special rules to a minimum (preferably none) in the process.

Here's an idea however to get a Snotling/Gobbo in the team Most teams have a 'big guy' slot in the roster for Ogres, trolls etc... Ogre teams could have a 'little guy' slot.

Aaaaaaaanyway, rambling away here heheh.. Ogres should be the majority players if it's an Ogre team, though we do need make weights to fill in if we stick with a one mill gold crown start.

[Ghost of Pariah]

I wouldn't be opposed to human players on the Ogre team. I think if vampires get them then why can't ogres?

Maybe this would be the chance to bring back the Human Blocker!


Okay one more roster brainstorm and then I'll let somebody else ramble...

0-12 Ogre Lineman 70K 5 4 1 8 Bonehead, Thick Skull -Gen
0-6 Human Allies 50K 6 3 3 8 -Gen
0-4 Ogre Blockers 120K 5 5 2 9 Bonehead, Thick Skull, TTM, Mighty Blow -Gen, ST
Re-Rolls 80K

Allies can't use re-rolls. Bonehead can't be re-rolled.

[Ithilkir]

Ok, my last roster before bed

Code: Select all

Qty    Position                Mv St Ag Av   Skills & Traits          Cost       Skill Groups 
0-12   Ogre Blocker            5  5  2  9    Bone Head, Mighty Blow   120,000    Gn, St 
                                             Thick Skull 
0-4    Ogre Blitzer            6  4  2  9    Bone Head, Break Tackle  120,000    Gn, St 
                                             Thick Skull
0-2    Ogre Thrower            5  4  2  8    Bone Head, Pass, Throw   120,000    Gn, Pas
                                             Team Mate, Thick Skull
0-4    Human Allies            6  3  3  8    -                         50,000    Gn

           OR

0-4    Goblin Allies           6  2  3  7    Right Stuff, Dodge,       40,000    Ag
                                             Stunty

Ogre teams can have either Human or Goblin allies, not a mixture (So you can't have a human and a goblin on the roster at the same time)

Re-rolls: 80-100k

[GalakStarscraper]

The only question I guess I have is it really an Ogre if it has ST 4 ... I know, I know Pariah said positive comments only.

But the Ogre suggestion I posted could have 6 ST 5 Ogres. This team only has 2. I guess what I don't understand is why this team is more Ogre than the one I had suggested using 0-6 Ogres and 0-16 Snotlings?

The starting Ogre team in BB Mag #1 had 8 Ogres, 4 FF, and no Re-Rolls.
If you wanted to do the same power level, with the new roster you could have had 6 Ogres, 5 Snotling, 8 FF, and 1 Reroll. Now I know Pariah disagrees but these teams seem VERY similar to me, and I just feel that 6 Ogres on a team are a lot more of an Ogre team than 2 Ogres with some Bonehead BOBs, Chaos Warriors, or Bull Centaurs clones/knock-offs.

I'd rather see the allowed #of Ogres pumped up to 0-8 on the Ogre/Snotling roster if the becrying call is its not Ogre enough.

Sorry, just my opinion.

Galak

[Ithilkir]

OOps... guess you can throw my roster out the window, just realised you can't actually make a team from it (too expensive). Bleh.. bed calls anyway, I'll check on what peeps are saying in the morning

[Ghost of Pariah]

Well the difference is the rest of the team isn't it?
I feel an ogre team should be brutish and thuggish. Lots of blocks and lots of plodding up the middle in a cage.
Not an acrobatic show with stupid little weaklings.

I mean why give the ogres snotlings? What's wrong with humans?

I don't think the 2 rosters are unalike, Galak. I think that under your team rules that nobody will build a roster like that. There are differences and those difference make that roster silly. Why would I take 6 ogres when I would only need 2? The best way to score with that team is TTM. You don't need 6 ogres for that. You need re-rolls. Most people are gonna grab rerolls over ogres. The rerolls are cheaper and more useful, and more expensive later. Also under the LRB cash flow system, you are gonna have either re-rolls or ogres but not both.

[dakkakhan]

How about a Really Stupid that requires a non-stupid player to be standing adjacent to be reduced to just Bonehead. Then, with the all- Ogre team, an opponent would have to be in the player's tacklezone for that player to be Boneheaded instead of the normal really stupid.

In game reason, Ogres have trouble deciding what to do, but with somebody to Thump, the process is easier for them. "hey, dey wanna get dat fussball thingy, and score a toochdurn! I'll frump'im good, I will!"

With this in place you could reduce the price of the ogres to an affordable amount to field enough for a team, becuase you may not get to use many of your players each turn. This will keep the fluff of Ogre teams not being very good because with out the stimuli of someone in your tackle zone you'll have trouble getting your players to know what they're doing, but when you get them going you'll squash some people. This makes staying away from Ogres a more viable tactic than it was already. What do you think?

[Darkson]

As an idea I really like it. Wheter it could be balanced or viable I don't know, but as an idea, spot on.

[Darkson]

By the way, has anyone got a copy of the BBC collabaration Bretonnian team?

[Thadrin]

I'm sticking to my guns on this idea.
Taking the premise that ogre teams are comprised of the players not good enough for the big leagues, we should have an Ogre Lineman, with the ones all the rest of the world hires being the Blockers.

This gives:
0-10 Ogre Lineman 5/4/1/9/Bonehead, Mighty Blow, Thick Skull 80k
0-6 Ogre Blocker 5/5/2/9/Bonehead, Mighty Blow, Thick Skull 120k
Rerolls 60k.

So a starting line up could be 10 Linemen, 1 Blocker, 1 reroll, 2 FF.