Drawing the line and probabilities

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Tue Feb 04, 2003 2:38 pm

Jesus Saves= Jesus was attacked by a magic spell or poison or something and made his "saving throw" It's an old D&D mechanic. You had 5 scores "Save VS. Poison, Death Ray, Spell, Dragon Breath etc" When you got attacked by a spell you made a "saving throw vs. spell" If you passed it was said, "So-and-so saves"'
Then every round of combat started with a roll for initiative. (Who goes first)
So if Jesus was attacked by a spell from the last NPC to attack the DM would say, "Jesus Saves. Roll initiative"

It's only funny if you are a certified dork; like me!

Indigo · Post by **Indigo** » Tue Feb 04, 2003 2:49 pm

heh I got the Jesus saves bit, just the initiative roll lost me

I was a dork once, and I'm trying damn hard to become one again, just ask the wife

"so what exactly do you use those little men for?"

(I realise that taken out of context, that sentence sounds quite bad...)

DaImp · Post by **DaImp** » Tue Feb 04, 2003 6:24 pm

Indigo wrote:
What Would Nuffle Do

I like that better

)

What Would Yoda Do? ............. "pray you will....hmmmmmmmmm?"

DaImp · Post by **DaImp** » Tue Feb 04, 2003 6:27 pm

[quote="Indigo"]
I was a dork once, and I'm trying damn hard to become one again, just ask the wife

"so what exactly do you use those little men for?"
[quote]

thats why I only play with female miniatures

somehow people don't seem to think thats any cooler though.....

neoliminal · Post by **neoliminal** » Tue Feb 04, 2003 6:28 pm

Indigo wrote:heh I got the Jesus saves bit, just the initiative roll lost me
I was a dork once, and I'm trying damn hard to become one again, just ask the wife
"so what exactly do you use those little men for?"

(I realise that taken out of context, that sentence sounds quite bad...)

Try this one:

"I'm going to go over to my friends basement to playing with my imaginary dwarf in the dungeons."

BoB · Post by **BoB** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 12:29 am

Pariah wrote: People cheat at D&D for cryin out loud!! That one blew my mind. Why cheat at agame you can't "win"?

Are you honestly telling me Pariah that you have never rerolled a to hit die when the DM didnt notice your first role and it was a 2?
I think everyone has got frustrated with their percieved bad luck at some stage and has had a go at stacking the odds in their favour.
As you said, its a game. That means that if your opponent cheats on something minor and you honestly believe its just a game then you shouldnt come down on them like a ton of bricks.
Since my league is all friends i suppose we have it easier. MOst of the time if someone is being crushed we will give them the benefit of the doubt on whether or not they are out of rerolls for the half when they role their 20th 1 for the half.

Take it easy ppl. Dice rolling isnt that big a deal. Throwing the dice flat is only cheating if you know how to do it and that it works. Otherwise you are just as likely to throw it flat with a one or two up as with a five or six.

Just cuz someone rolls a six when they throw the dice weird is not a reason to ban their dice, chop off their hands and force them to roll registered and approved 12mm GW dice using only their mouth with their eyes closed.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 12:41 am

BoB wrote: Are you honestly telling me Pariah that you have never rerolled a to hit die when the DM didnt notice your first role and it was a 2?

Umm...I am honestly telling you that I have never cheated at D&D. See, in our group the DM (which is usually me) won't kill a player based on one bad roll of the dice. There's no need to cheat.

BoB · Post by **BoB** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 2:18 am

Ahh, so instead of cheating you have "modified the rules"
lol

neoliminal · Post by **neoliminal** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 4:31 am

BoB wrote: Are you honestly telling me Pariah that you have never rerolled a to hit die when the DM didnt notice your first role and it was a 2.

Classic projection.

I've been playing D&D for over 18 years. I've never cheated. Why would I? It's the story that matters and failures make for the best stories. Don't convince yourself this is okay. Fight the desire to cheat.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 4:44 am

Um no we didn't modify the rules. The DM is in control of what happens. If he says I hit a creature then I hit the creature.

The dice don't rule the game. The DM does. If you play differently then you are the one "modifying the rules" D&D is not meant to be a win or lose game. Neo is right, failures make the best stories!

Example...In Return of the Jedi, the Rebellion won the war because Han Solo failed a "move silently" check. If Han had successfully snuck up on the Scout Trooper then they would not have met the Ewoks and would not have been rescued when they were captured by the Emperor's trap. The shield would have stayed up and the Rebel fleet would have been destroyed, along with the Rebel leaders. Mon Mothma was aboard Ackbar's cruiser. Luke would not have been able to leave the Death Star on a shuttle and probably would have been overwhelmed by Imperial troops.

All that because Han stepped on a twig and got beat up.

BoB · Post by **BoB** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 5:59 am

I would say that the DM intervening to assure that you dont die is modifying the rules.... I have no problem with this
let me make it perfectly clear that i believe that a small amount of cheating is to be expected in all games.

On a side note, there is a monster in D&D that we call the "hurty-hurty burny-hot worm thing"
I cant remember its real name. It isnt that it is overly dangerous in its attacks...It just melts weapons....all weapons.
Its description means it is very hot inside (so it can burrow through ice)
It does a lot of damage to all weapons and armour in contact with it.
Then it swallowed me. Its swallow damage isnt in the monster manual.....yet it can melt steel so that doesnt bode well for characters swallowed.
In the end the DM ruled that i was dead and the rest of the party had to use a ten foot halberd to kill it. By the end of the fight the halberd was 1 foot long.
They also threw a lot of rocks at it.
I appreciate that this aint on topic, but if anyone can remember the name of the monster it would stop me wondering.

sorry, got sidetracked there.

Mestari · Post by **Mestari** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 7:24 am

Back to topic:

Somebody said that the guys talking about regulated dice etc. are taking the fun out of the game. Wrong.

Even the doubt of someone abusing the rules and using crooked dice takes the fun out of it twice as effectively. By ruling the use of dice in advance no-one should have any problems with it and it ensures that everyone has fun and cannot blame anything else except the dice for their losses.

The 2nd ed tournaments that somebody mentioned about (where that one guy won with incredible luck and the two specific sets of dice):
That guy could've just been lucky! But it sure does seem like he was cheating. If he were given dice by the organisers, there would be no room for complaints, people would just have to say that he was lucky in addition to a good player. Refusing to enforce dice-rolling rules made those tournaments a lot less fun for those who suspected that the guy was cheating.

neoliminal · Post by **neoliminal** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 8:02 am

Great point. Why let a little luck brand you as a cheater? Use sound randomizing techniques and remove all doubt that it's your incredible skill that wins games.

Heiper · Post by **Heiper** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:31 am

BoB wrote:I would say that the DM intervening to assure that you dont die is modifying the rules.... I have no problem with this
let me make it perfectly clear that i believe that a small amount of cheating is to be expected in all games.

On a side note, there is a monster in D&D that we call the "hurty-hurty burny-hot worm thing"
I cant remember its real name. It isnt that it is overly dangerous in its attacks...It just melts weapons....all weapons.
Its description means it is very hot inside (so it can burrow through ice)
It does a lot of damage to all weapons and armour in contact with it.
Then it swallowed me. Its swallow damage isnt in the monster manual.....yet it can melt steel so that doesnt bode well for characters swallowed.
In the end the DM ruled that i was dead and the rest of the party had to use a ten foot halberd to kill it. By the end of the fight the halberd was 1 foot long.
They also threw a lot of rocks at it.
I appreciate that this aint on topic, but if anyone can remember the name of the monster it would stop me wondering.

sorry, got sidetracked there.

I guess you are talking about the Rhemoraz (I think thats how its spelled). Funny creature to fight against

. I know one that got that Swallow whole, nastie. Anyways, I'm also a DM and to "controll" the dice is a big part of being a DM IMO. 1st rule of RPG is "The GM is ALWAYS right" remeber that

What a DM is to do is not to just throw monsters at them for the fun of it, it is to make a compelling story that the players are a part of, remeber the players are the Heros/Anti-Heros(evil cha.) of your story, so to kill one in every game sessoin would not really make them big Heros, would it?

There is a reason you have GM screens.

On to BB, I know one that has a loaded dice, but he's never used it, and we all know is loaded anyway. Can't say I've seen ppl trying to cheat in BB, as we all see each others dice rolls, on Skill, age etc. Could be that some change it before they send it in to the commish, but I hope not. At least we don't have problems with the dice when we are playing.

CyberHare · Post by **CyberHare** » Wed Feb 05, 2003 11:48 am

Some of the individuals replying to this thread are of the opinion that Blood Bowl is just a game and that people should relax and have fun. They are absolutely right. Blood Bowl is just a game. We play it to have fun, meet new people, and generally have a good time. In a league setting it really doesn't matter who is using what type of dice as long as everyone is happy. If someone isn't happy they work it out as with anything else that happens in a league. I totally agree with what they are saying. It could never work to try and bring dice rules into the official league rules. No one would ever follow them.

When you are playing in a tournament though you are no longer playing just a game. It is a contest. You usually have to pay to participate and there are prizes to be won, NAF rating to defend. If it is still just a game to someone at that point then why would they care if there were regulations to cover the type of dice to be used. What amount of enjoyment would be taken away from the game if, in a tournament setting, people were all asked to use the same type of dice? None. In fact it would do just as Neo has said, though tongue in cheek as it were. It would take away that one nagging suspicion in the back of your mind. You would know that the dice the other guy is using are just as sad as your own.

I can't see at all how dice rules would hurt the game or the enjoyment there of.