Bretonnian roster... What's the deal?

[harvestmouse]

Is it? I mean what is that ST4 guy...............I'm not even sure. Is he a shape shifter? Is he part wolf? Is he a guy that likes wearing a wolf suit? I do remember the Ulfwerener ish from 3rd ed warhammer, but without shape shifting rules, it's all a bit vague.

And where did this Snow Troll fellow come from? I don't remember him from anywhere (I don't have any books with me, so I can't check).

Then you have the renaming of the blitzer to a berzerker which is just bizarre. What must he have thought going down the corridor seeing the whole High Elf squad, the Longbeard and the Storm Vermin going in the direction? It's like they gave the Norse job to somebody totally different.

Then we have the redundant positional problem. The catcher was never redundant. Trust me I played as much lrb 4 Norse as anyone, and he was my favourite player at high TV, due to the A access. So what do they do............make him a bloody runner. When all the other runners are P access. Then to up the bizarreness a bit, lets slap dauntless on him. A quasi thrower/catcher fits dauntless perfectly.

Which means you still have the redundant positional left as he was, the thrower.

I just cannot comprehend the weirdness and out of sorts job done on this roster. I think it plays pretty well, but sits ill for me. What I think they should have done was:

Thrower becomes an MA7 runner
Catcher stays the same
Blitzer keeps his name
Snow Troll stays in the snow and they keep the mino/ogre option
Invent a lunatic of a berzerker position. ST4 no hands loony that just wants to bite stuff

You have all the same key parts, but it sits better and you have use of the P access guy, due to the extra ma.

In my mind I just do not understand how the same crew who did the Pact, Slann and Underworld teams (which to me are fantastic) did Norse.

[Decker_cky]

Berzerker is definitely the right title for the former norse blitzers. If we were to change everything to standardized names, witch elves and troll slayers would also fit the berzerker mould.

Ulfwerners are norse werewolves. Pretty sure they've always had shapeshifters in the norse background.

Snow trolls are new from what I remember. But no other big guy actually fits norse, and fluffwise they were always underdeveloped. Who knows what's going on there.

Agree with you on the runner's abilities not fitting though. No clue why they made it a dauntless players (amusingly, that was added as they added the ulfs which addressed the lack of strength on the roster).

[Darkson]

Norse was in the journal, don't ask me which one as I'm not sure nor do I have it.
Then the official team came out (LRB1?) and went cookie cutter.

[Shteve0]

As much as it pains me to crash this party, you guys realise they're called blitzers and catchers in CRP, right?

[harvestmouse]

Norse were around in 2nd edition, I can't remember if they were in first edition. However I'd guess so, to get more use out of Bryan Ansell's figures.

Norse 2nd edition teams were exactly the same as humans however they dropped catchers (and maybe throwers) and took in berserkers.

I can't remember the rules exactly, however they were a bit like werewolves in that they went berserk at some point (between scores maybe) and became berserk and lost a turn.

A berserk player doesn't care about the ball or his own health (similar to those in WFB). They gain strength and no hands. I think this bit is pretty key to be honest.

So no, the blitzer is not a berserker as he isn't out of control. Frenzy does portray this well, however he's still a ball player. As for the Ulfwererener I'm really not sure what he's trying to portray. There's nothing wolf like (claws) there's no transformation and nothing animalesque. Just a bizarely named ST4/AG2.

I think there's room for a few established positionals, to make things interesting. A kicker, a more unified runner and a berserker type, they could have even gone for some sort of special rules with him.

[Steam Ball]

As much as it pains me to crash this party, you guys realise they're called blitzers and catchers in CRP, right?

And Snow Troll was Yhetee in at least one previous PDF (the copy I got as m2350017a_m780049a_Blood_Bowl_Competition_Rules.pdf to be precise).

[Shteve0]

Cool. For what it's worth, I think Norse are basically fine. Throwers are pretty popular down this way, not just for their leader. I like the runner, even if not as a catcher. Ulfwereners I don't really care for, but that's probably not having played them in a league. Then again I don't read (or particularly care about) Warhammer fluff.

[Decker_cky]

As much as it pains me to crash this party, you guys realise they're called blitzers and catchers in CRP, right?

They (along with Ulfs and Snow troll) were renamed to match things in the GW store in the CRP (essentially, a shoehorned change from what the development intention for LRB5 was). Catchers in particular *really* don't make sense in that setup.

I consider the LRB6 (Icepelt) the blood bowl bible rather than the CRP.

[harvestmouse]

I never knew that about the name changes. I feel a bit better about life now. Yhetee and Snow Troll I knew, it's better as a snow troll. A non MB big guy though is weird and obviously just for diversity.

So what were Ulf's renamed to? I'll admit I don't have a copy of CRP, I also use Icepelt.

Totally confused. Just checked CRP Norse Werewolves and back to Yhetees!

[legowarrior]

Just wait until the norse come out for bb2. That will be the offical names.

[Decker_cky]

I never knew that about the name changes. I feel a bit better about life now. Yhetee and Snow Troll I knew, it's better as a snow troll. A non MB big guy though is weird and obviously just for diversity.

So what were Ulf's renamed to? I'll admit I don't have a copy of CRP, I also use Icepelt.

Totally confused. Just checked CRP Norse Werewolves and back to Yhetees!

CRP is the only place that Yhetees was ever used. Snow troll is the LRB5/vault name. It was changed in the CRP to match a model GW made (which has nothing to do with the norse fluffwise).

[SunDevil]

Locally we call the Ulfs 'Bjornwereners' or 'man-bears'. We don't like the werewolf connection since that only came about because GW made werewolf minis and not ulf/bear/men minis.

I love the Norse Runner and I love that he is a Runner. The Norse come from snowy, icy mountainous areas...so they throw the ball? Nope. Dauntless fits the flavor and theme of the team, right along with the Frenzy Berzerkers, as brawling warriors not concerned with their own safety and not afraid to back down from bigger foes. They are a running team that is only ever barely in control.

I don't even acknowledge the Thrower. One of the most redundant (which I think harvestmouse mentioned) positionals in all of BB.

As for Brets, I am less convinced about their theme but I do like the roster. It plays well right off the bat and seems to stay respectable for awhile. Mechanically, anyway, I am really enjoying them.

[Decker_cky]

I love the Norse Runner and I love that he is a Runner. The Norse come from snowy, icy mountainous areas...so they throw the ball? Nope. Dauntless fits the flavor and theme of the team, right along with the Frenzy Berzerkers, as brawling warriors not concerned with their own safety and not afraid to back down from bigger foes. They are a running team that is only ever barely in control.

The issue is that every other runner gains only Pass access. Norse runner is the only runner that gains agility access.

I don't mind the dauntless on the runner mechanically and in the scope of the team, thematically. But why is a runner dauntless? Why does he have agility access as a runner?

It's like they went "We don't really like the catcher, but want to retain agility access. Dauntless seems more norsey than a catcher." Then they had a really cool gaming piece, but needed to name it so called it runner, which was added to a few teams at that point.

Honestly, I think "blitzer" is closer to the right name for them than runner - they gain speed and a blocking skill. I wonder how the team would have balanced if they changed that agility access to strength access and called them blitzers.

[SunDevil]

I have no problem with him being a bit different than the other Runners with his lack of P access. BB teams should be MORE diverse, not more similar, in my opinion.

He only needs to be slightly more agile than his brethren to earn the Runner position. And the Dauntless works as he will run right at an opponent instead of around him if need be.

He isn't a Blitzer, despite the similarities, because he should not be the first option to hit someone. That is the Berzerker's job. But, again, the Runner will run over a guy if he has to.

Agility access, to me, just means he is slightly more nimble than the other guys trying out for the team. The extra speed is part of that as well. But he doesn't approach Elf levels of agile so no 4AG to start.

[Shteve0]

Two sundevil posts about norse, and not a single mention of 'Runnr'