Rhyoth wrote:_
Dolfar : he costs the same as a merc with kick, but comes with 3 bonus skills (sure they're not outstanding skills, but hey, they're free), so how can he be a bad deal ?
So, unless you make mercs cheaper, there is no reason to change him (or at least, not for free).
Its a bad deal because those skills are pretty much worthless. I would like it to be a harder choice between Dolphar and 2 babes frankly. At the moment he is just not even worth considering. You can also get him on High Elf teams. Personally I would prefer a merc in the current rules over him, because he has av7 and i would get no use out of any of his skills other than kick. In all my games i have played TT and online leagues and online MM I have never once seen him taken. He is just not even a consideration at the moment. Getting rid of the pointless Diving Tackle and giving him Wrestle at least allows him to function as a team member. Otherwise i would rather him not be on the field, because rookie linemen are better at blocking and doging than him and he is meant to be a star.
_ Amazons :
Again be careful about fluff quotes, they're often exagerated : in this case, they just mean zons start with Dodge...
True, it is often exagerrated, but the fluff for every other team fits their team perfectly. Zons Teams don't come close to resembling the fluff in CRP and pre CRP. This is what all teams need to be based around first and foremost, it is the most important factor in team design along with balance and fun.
The same goes for Stand Firm : if Stand Firm gives a bonus to dodge, it's to represent the fact that the player is too strong/large/heavy to be tackled effectively : that's why it's a
Strength skill, requiring a
Strength roll, and why only slow but strong and heavy player like
Deathroller,
Treemen or
Flesh Golem have it as a starting skill (and i bet those players aren't exactly
"graceful" when they "dodge").
It is a strength skill yes, but it still makes the sort of plays that they apparently famous for possible, and the team is decribed as having a mix of strenght and other things, as quoted before. Without it they are far less likely to ever happen. Also after looking at many of the top Amazons teams on fumbbl and through playing them a lot back in lrb4) it became quite clear that Blitzers were used in two ways, 1 was the MB PO player, the others main function would be to tie players up, essentially working as Blockers not Blitzers. Stand Firm was a very common skill selection at the 4th and 5th skill for this player, and by removing block it stop them being blodge guard after one skill which is a nightmare for any low tv teams, but by the 4th or 5th skill they are back on track, so it doesnt hurt them long term.
AV 8 : since giving those girls an AV increase clearly goes against their fluff, then it should used only as a last measure, only if all other options available failed (unless you find a
suitable concept for an AV8 piece : like some kind of dangerous monster from Lustrians jungles, or maybe some kind of armored male slave used as human shield...).
this does not go against their fluff. Av8 is not an indicator of their armour alone, otherwise everyone would just stick plate mail on. It is a value given to a player that represents their natural toughness and ability to take knocks. Since the blitzers are descibed as 'powerful warriors' and i could provide you with a number of quotes if you really want, that lend them self to this, there is nothing out of place with it. It also makes their roster more interesting, as said before the 6337 across the board is just unimagiative, dull and it allows very little room for tactical use as a player type, in crp all their players basically run interfearance while one scores. Finally it is a slight help for the long term build.
_ Norse :
garion wrote:its not about spoiling the fun, as posted before, it is to make the rules consistent, runners have P access like Dark Elves. It is more to give them the choice of going down the Dump Off route and specialising in the running game as per their fluff and not the passing game.
it's what this rule will do : spoil the fun of a few number of player,
for no good reason :
_ the Thrower does not make the team overpowered
_ the Thrower does not make the team too much "Pass-oriented", since a lot of ccoach just skip him anyway
_ there is no
need to give Runners P skills, just like there is no
need to give Elf Blitzers S skills : sure they have the same name, but they play in very different team, have different use, and thus different profile.
_ as far as the dumpster route is concerned, it's a more viable option for the current Thrower, than it would be for this Runner : for him, it simply requires too many sacrifices.
Im at work at the moment, so cant provide quotes but i will update later, I have already explained that i want the 3 human teams to be different to each other as the fluff suggests, Norse are a bash team, human a flexible team, and Zons a passing team. There is no fluff that would suggest the norse would have a thrower, they are a team built around bash. The thrower is out of place. It is simple as that. He does not belong on this team, yes people may not develop runners as throwers, but they have that option now as a late skill choice. Norse are not meant to be flexible in their approach to games, they are all about aggresive kamikaze tactics, which sometimes win them games and sometimes doesn't, Frenzy is what they are all about, why would they have throwers when they don't have catchers, because they are not meant to have these types of players or perform these types of plays it goes against everything you read. the fact you say well why not give Elf Blitzers S then, is just a flippant comment. You know perfectly well why they don't. Running back on the other hand is a basic position in Amercian Football. While in amarican football they play along side QBs typically, bloodbowl obviously works differently because a fair number of teams dont have QBs, especially those focused on bash and it is the role of the player that is important. Running Backs are typically either handed the ball by the QB or they will receive it straight from the snap. If a team has two (which norse do) one will function has a half back/tail back and they will run with the ball, the other, the full back will function as a Blocker supporting the runner. This is very much how Norse play, the spare one fronting a cage with blodge SS. Half Backs also do throw the ball albeit rarely, but again that supports giving them the ability to take P skills and Dump Off plays are more common than straight passes for those player types, so this change adds verisimilitude and also makes the teams consistent. Dark Elf runners annd Norse Runners are the same position, the difference is norse play an 'Up the middle' running play, or a 'Draw'. while Dark Elf runners play a 'Counter' running play most of the time or an 'End-Around'. But the basic function of the Runners is universal and as such should be reflected in their ability to make certain plays. 
