Why the necromantic team is unbalanced !!!

DaFrenchCoach · Post by **DaFrenchCoach** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 2:00 am

I didn't see it immediately, but the necromantic team breaks a rule that was given by a rulz guru (praise, praise !!!):

this team has 4 ghouls, 4 wights, 2 flesh golme and a werewolf, so 11 nonlineman position !!!!

the rule is:
a) The number of players in the single non-lineman positions (Lineman=0-8, 0-12, or 0-16) are limited to 10 slots in total.

It also breaks another rule (but it's only a suggesiton there, i guess):
11) Number of Team Positions:
a) Team Rosters should not have more than 4 player positions.

but maybe I misunderstood the guide lines ? What do you think about ?

Lucien Swift · Post by **Lucien Swift** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 2:08 am

all observations are valid and correct... it's a pretty unfortunate roster...

they can do better...

DaFrenchCoach · Post by **DaFrenchCoach** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 2:34 am

Hey, Lucien, whoever, ...

your new avatar sounds like a promise...

Lucien Swift · Post by **Lucien Swift** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 2:47 am

well, an unused roll of greenstuff certainly looks familiar these days

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:10 am

The team building guidelines are just that guidelines ... I wish Jervis would download the page though and look at it ... a lot could be gained from a review of his own history.

Okay, you want me to be blunt here. My opinion on this one is that the Necromatic team was a rather pathetic attempt to sell minis. There are two figs still in production for Frank N' Stein and Wilhelm Chaney. These two old star players are no longer stars in the LRB .... so Jervis has the new rule for Fanatic ... a fig for every rule and a rule for every fig. That meant he needed to create a rule for the werewolf and flesh golem figs in order to keep them in production.

The problem is that Jervis doing teams in a vaccuum is almost always met hostilely by the BB community ... I don't know why but its seems true ... see OSPA. Now the funny thing here is that the Necromantic team is not that different from the Halloweenies team of the MBBL2:

http://www.midgardbb.com/MBBLTeams/Halloweenies.html

So using that team and the current ... a team that would be a MORE interest to me and not so thrown together looking as the current one would be:

NECROMANTIC TEAM LIST

Qty Title Cost MA ST AG AV S&K
0-12 Zombies 30k 4 3 2 8 Regen
0-4 Ghouls 70k 7 3 2 7 Dodge
0-2 Wights 90k 6 3 3 8 Regen, Block
0-2 Werewolf 110k 7 4 2 8 Mighty Blow, Break Tackle, Frenzy
0-2 Flesh Golem 110k 4 4 2 9 Regen, Stand Firm, Thick Skull
Re-roll counter: 70.000 gold pieces

This team I could at least agree with based on the current official teams and the history of the game. And yes this team has 6 players with no regen compared to 7 on the old roster, but at least to me it seems not so hacked together.

Galak

neoliminal · Post by **neoliminal** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:13 am

There are experimental rules. So if you don't like them, send mail to Jervis and tell him why.

Mestari · Post by **Mestari** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 7:06 am

The 0-1 limit on the werewolf (whose stats don't look like a werewolf at all) seems real strange. IMO there should be a possibility of buying at least two players of each position in order to have a lower-developed replacement if/when the more developed one bites the dust.

Even though I'd prefer the current undead team over the suggested ones, it is clear that the money issues of GW getting to sell minis will triumph on this one and two undead teams will be official reality soon enough. So we should do our best to develop them as long as they are experimental.

Necromantic team:
I whole-heartedly support Galaks suggestion above. Regen would fit to the werewolves too, as they are supposed to be rather invulnerable to everything except silver. But that might make them a bit too powerful, but a suggestion anyhow.

Khemri team:
I completely dislike the -Ra's. Magic helmets? No way. I've seen only-skeleton teams cope with their lack of skills and agility (not greatly, mind you, but they weren't a complete joke).
So my suggestion would be to ditch -Ra's (SH+Pass for a rookie skeleton just seems incomprehensible to me) and replace them with skeletal runners that have ma6,ag2 and sure hands. This team also has the advantage of being able to use the new khemri team figures. The ones with the helmets are runners.

KHEMRI TEAM LIST
Qty Title Cost MA ST AG AV S&T
0-12 Skeletons 30k 5 3 2 7 Regenerate (gen)
0-4 Skel.Runners 50k 6 3 2 7 Regenerate,Sure Hands (gen)
0-4 Mummies 110k 3 5 1 9 Regenerate, Mighty Blow (gen, st)
Re-roll: 70.000 gp

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 7:21 am

I think the Khemri team is much more imbalanced. 4 mummies, 2 throwers and two blitzers? Come on... Where's the weak point here?

Post by **GalakStarscraper** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 12:36 pm

neoliminal wrote:There are experimental rules. So if you don't like them, send mail to Jervis and tell him why.

Neo ... you don't need to mean face me ..

...

Its just that JJ doesn't have a great track record of development lately on his own. I don't know what happened. He created a lot of great teams to develop the original game which I love, but then it sorta faded.

I'll send him an e-mail about the Necromatic. I'm hoping that the Vampire teams have some balance to them though.

Galak

DaFrenchCoach · Post by **DaFrenchCoach** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 1:18 pm

About Necromantic: I'm with Galak on this: it should have something to see with business... But some 2nd edition minis are still available on GW Website, correct ? There are some starplayers is I remind it well... We don't see them in roster team (we want secret weapons !

)

Just 2 suggestions: removing this werewolf, and making it a starplayer, like it was before, Whilhelm Chaney.

Ghost of Pariah · Post by **Ghost of Pariah** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 3:53 pm

Neo wrote:

There are experimental rules. So if you don't like them, send mail to Jervis and tell him why.

And why are we not allowed to discuss them here? If I'm not mistaken this is a Blood Bowl discussion board, is it not? I make no apologies for not liking a rule. JJ creation or not.

Zombie wrote:

I think the Khemri team is much more imbalanced. 4 mummies, 2 throwers and two blitzers? Come on... Where's the weak point here?

The weak point would be low AV, low MA, and only 2 blitzers/receivers. Admittedly though, I'd like to see the Throw-Ra's have ST2 or the Blitz-Ra's have AG 2.

Zombie · Post by **Zombie** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 6:06 pm

I didn't notice the low MA and AV. Good job pointing that out. I still don't like seeing a team with 4 mummies and 2 throwers though.

Post by **Thadrin** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 7:11 pm

The werewolf should be made official - as a damn Star Player for the Norse (you can make him Norse or Undead if you wish...I'm not fussed).
I otherwise wholeheartedly agree with Galak's suggestion (DFC - note the Zombie is the line position so I'm afraid you're wrong there mate.)

And I'm also completely in agreement with my Finnish colleague - the Khemri roster and those

magic

Helmets

is absolutely AWFUL. Nothing on earth would make me want to use that team, which is a shame because Philcien's phigs look very much up to his usual high standard (I will get my divine wind team painted...I will get my divine wind team painted...) once they're assembled.

DaFrenchCoach · Post by **DaFrenchCoach** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 8:13 pm

Thadrin wrote:DFC - note the Zombie is the line position so I'm afraid you're wrong there mate.

Hum Thads, what do you mean exactly ? What I want to say: if I've well understood Neo guide lines, when making a team roster, it's good to make 0-X linemen, and a max of 10 non lineman position. I know zombie is the line position, so ther are 10 places on the roster or non lineman (ie non zombie) position... 4 ghouls, 4 wights, 2 flesh (who said french ?

) golem, and a werewolf... So a max of 11 non position players...

Just a quesiton: how were the feedbacks from coaches when releasing rules for lizardmen, amazons, ... ? I didn't know BB boards when released, only some websites, and I'm curious to know if it was the same or not...

Post by **Thadrin** » Sat Aug 31, 2002 8:44 pm

DFC - Sorry....for some strange reason I read no lineman position. You are in fact utterly right, and I am a completely fool.

But we knew THAT already. Its been one of those days....